SwiftDeath
Member
ah ok so it's like 20% of the market and would be highly indicative of trends of course
Thank you btw
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Media Create Sales: Week 7, 2014 (Feb 10 - Feb 16)
- Thread starter Chris1964
- Start date
ah ok so it's like 20% of the market and would be highly indicative of trends of course
Thank you btw
haven't been the cases in 2014 and I don't even know when was the last time Tsutaya chart is "near identical" to MC & Famitsu. It is not more accurate than the COMG chart.
Nope. Warranty is not valid throughout the region.
What we have is a warranty service for 6 South East Asian countries including Indonesia, Malaysia, Philippines, Singapore, Thailand and Vietnam.
http://asia.playstation.com/sg/en/newsdetail?id=1420
Apophis2036
Banned
I keep seeing people saying that XBone's main problem is it's price and everything will improve once it hits the same price as PS4 (which I actually agree with to an extent) but don't you think price point is a major factor in the poor WiiU hardware sales ?.
The cheapest WiiU has been since it launched is $299 in America and 15 months later $299 is still the cheapest it can be bought. There basically has been no price cut from Nintendo but rather software included to try and improve sales.
It's clear that Nintendo are not trying to compete with PS4/XBone and are instead going after the family market so don't you accept that price point is a major, major factor in such a family focused product ?.
I think if Nintendo can get the price down to $249, first in time for MK8 and then to $199 in time for November for Smash Bros then the WiiU's fortunes will have a drastic improvement, much more significant than we saw in 2013's Holiday period.
In terms of exclusive software for late 2012, 2013 & 2014, it would be hard to argue against WiiU when compared with PS4 and XBone's first year exclusive output -
PS4 -
Knack.
Killzone: Shadow Fall.
Resogun.
Infamous: Second Son.
The Order - Late 2014.
XBone -
Forza 5.
Ryse.
Dead Rising 3.
Titanfall.
Halo Anniversary 2 - Late 2014.
WiiU -
Nintendo Land.
NSMBU.
Lego City Undercover.
Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate.
Game & Wario.
Pikmin 3.
The Wonderful 101.
Wind Waker HD.
Sonic Lost World.
Wii Party U.
Mario 3D World.
Wii Fit U.
DKC: Tropical Freeze.
Mario Kart 8 - May.
Hyrule Warriors - July / August.
Bayonetta 2 - Sept / Oct.
Sonic Boom - Late 2014.
X - Late 2014.
Smash Bros 4 - Late 2014.
WiiU will also probably get Watch Dogs and the next Assassin's Creed / Call of Duty games because of Nintendo's relationship with Ubisoft and Activision.
These software choices added to the fact that WiiU would have free online play and be $200 cheaper than either PS4 or XBone (even after a $100 price cut) will mean Nintendo would have a great chance of cleaning up with certain demographics this Winter season all over the World.
Of course all of this relies on Nintendo cutting the price of the console significantly. If they do it, I see WiiU at least catching Gamecube on lifetime sales by late 2016.
A little OT because these are more Western points, but the "Family market" is CoD, GTA, and Minecraft. Many parents don't care about the rating on the cover, as long as it shuts their kid up for a few hours they don't care about them playing GTA. Not politically correct, but that is just the way it is.
pieatorium
Member
wiiu price has been slashed regularly across eu/aus to little effect, you could get premiums for the same price as US in aus last year and thats including tax vs no tax on the US price.
I would be very surprised if the next ass creed and COD come to wiiu, the sales of the previous attempt have been abysmal
Of course the wiiu has a better backlog of games, its been out for a year but those games ave done little to help its situation. If having 2 mario games was going to get someone to buy a wiiu they would already have jumped in
I would be very surprised if the next ass creed and COD come to wiiu, the sales of the previous attempt have been abysmal
Of course the wiiu has a better backlog of games, its been out for a year but those games ave done little to help its situation. If having 2 mario games was going to get someone to buy a wiiu they would already have jumped in
shinra-bansho
Member
There's a competing product on the market selling better offering a largely similar experience, for $100 cheaper, serving as evidence for a greater market for a product like the XB1 at a lower price.
Comparatively the Wii U has been price cut already, and has seen further retailer driven cuts and limited demand regardless.
They've made the wrong product for whatever remains of such a market. Just Dance sold better on the XB1 than the Wii U in the US in 2013. LEGO sold better on the XB1 in December iirc.
The first problem here is the assumption that the mass market cares enough about those exclusives to justify purchase. It was one of Nintendo's mistakes as well.
Good luck with that.
All this isn't to say a price drop won't lead to some improvement, but at considerable cost. And ultimately the sales would still be poor, because it simply doesn't offer something that's broadly appealing.
My guess is AC won't, COD might.
Apophis2036
Banned
All good points.
Don't you think that it's price is the major reason it's not 'broadly appealing' though ?, esp as it's going after a market where price along with software lineup is the most important aspect.
WiiU is grossly overpriced for what it is. I think it's unfair to completely write it off until we see what it does at the same price as the original Wii.
It makes no difference anyway. Kids are on X360/PS3 (depending on country) why would they want to change console to play the exact same game with the exact same graphics on a console different than all their friends already have? Then you have the core-gamer, they can already play the same game (with DLC etc) on PS3/60, or they can upgrade and play it with better graphics/framerate on XB1/PS4. Who in the world wants to play these multiplats on WiiU? Pixies and Fairies.
Apophis2036
Banned
sörine;102028013 said:
Yeah I think Skylanders all but guarantees another COD port. With AC there are rumours that there will be a last gen version aswell as a totally different PS4/Xbone version so I think WiiU will at least get a port of the last gen version. Nintendo also have a decent relationship with Ubisoft which should help.
If Tropical Freeze has the same lacklustre effect on hardware sales in the US/EU (on top of the Wii Fit U flop) that it did in Japan then I expect Iwata to announce an official price cut at the next investor meeting to 25000 Yen / £179 in the UK / $249 in North America, the same price Wii launched at.
shinra-bansho
Member
I think price is one of many reasons its unappealing.
Although underlying that, I think that the USP they've chosen is poor - it's doesn't wow, it's not easy to communicate, it doesn't address any substantial pain point in the market (they seemed to think that sharing a TV was a major issue for people). This coupled with the hardware power offering no impetus for transition, with the PS3 and 360 competing for laggard HD adopters at the low end of the market. They also designed a device that I think is rather specialised in a world where people expect convergence - you see it a lot when people say "They can position it as a second console." never questioning that the very premise of a second console may be flawed. While Sony and Microsoft are pitching an all in one home entertainment box - a more "serious" consumer electronic device, meant to take pride of place in the living room; Nintendo's offering at face value seems in comparison a device essentially designed just to play their games.
Nintendo's primary focus right now is a return to profitability, so while a price cut is necessary, it's not currently feasible.
Also that Skylanders will likely grace the Wii U has little bearing on whether Acti will bother with another COD on it.
Really, where was this place in the world where kids don't have their own TV set and the trend wasn't for households to have more and more TVs per house, even ignoring the advancement of tablets in the household? It just seems like Nintendo were in their own little fantasy world when they designed the WiiU.
Apophis2036
Banned
Fair enough, I respect your opinion. WiiU sales outside of the Holidays are a joke, of that there is no doubt but until I see it bomb at the original Wii price point I will stop short of completely writing it off in terms of hitting 15 million units Worldwide in it's lifetime.
Also wouldn't getting more systems in homes, even at a loss be evened out by Nintendo's own software then having a larger install base to sell to ?. If they sell an extra 10 million consoles by price cutting to $249 wouldn't that extra $50 loss on each system be made up by selling 10 million more copies of MK8 and 3D World ?.
With regards to the bolded, isn't Skylanders a massive seller on Wii and a decent seller on WiiU ?. I would think that would give Nintendo some leeway with regards to getting a port of the next CoD.
I think as long as PS360 are getting yearly AC and CoD games, then WiiU will also get them. If a port costs $2 million then they would only have to sell around 65 000 copies Worldwide to break even if Activision get $30 per sale. Are there official lifetime sales available for Black Ops II and Ghosts for WiiU ?. Surely big name WiiU third party ports like AC and CoD are selling 65 000 Worldwide...
Really, where was this place in the world where kids don't have their own TV set and the trend wasn't for households to have more and more TVs per house, even ignoring the advancement of tablets in the household? It just seems like Nintendo were in their own little fantasy world when they designed the WiiU.
It's quite surprising Nintendo was not aware that this is the era where everyone have their own screen, and interaction between ppl via game is now being done between individual devices, not within a single device like TV and gamepad on WIiU. I was expecting Nintendo was really sure of that due to its success on GB / GBA / DS / 3DS. At this current age even handheld devices have online capability you know...
It is like shift from gathering friends to a house and play split screen, to have them stay at their house, and communicate over internet, playing online games with everyone having own gaming device.
pieatorium
Member
even before tablets and phones pc's had made big strides as the second screen of entertainment, and not just for the kids evidenced by the rise of zynga. Phones and tablets scuttled the browser boom but there hasn't been this second screen gap for over a decade
.
even if the wiiu sells 10 million more that doesn't guarantee 10 million more software for nintendo. Look at sales of Gamecube games vs WiiU, mario kart and mario didint sell 10 million copies even though the gc is likely to sell 10 mill more in total hardware.
diferent target markets completely, acti isnt a charity they dont have an obligation to nintendo
Well the difference is obvious, those games are selling millions on ps360 and thousands on wiiu. Whats in it for act/ubi to spend that 2 million and maybe make back the money when they could spend it on on other platforms with much better potential ROI
pieatorium
Member
http://www.generatorresearch.com/te...s-average-number-of-tv-sets-per-tv-household/
scroll down to japan, its one of the highest
I didn't arrange the order, but I think the point is that Nintendo has to design their hardware for the world, not just Japan. Anyway, after Ireland;
http://www.generatorresearch.com/te...s-average-number-of-tv-sets-per-tv-household/
http://www.generatorresearch.com/te...s-average-number-of-tv-sets-per-tv-household/
I remember the philosophy was more to try to keep the family together in the living room during the evenings instead of everyone off to their separate rooms. But dual screen uses and off-tv play are contrasting benefits -- that's where it gets muddy.
It irritates me that people can say these games sold abysmally without any numbers to back it up. We really don't know how poorly they did, other than having part of the first month of data. Did they sell better in December, since that is the gift giving season and Nintendo is strong there? Did they sell somewhat consistently over time? Who knows. We only have a fraction of data, during a period where new release Wii U games are pretty hard to find.
That said, I'm sure they sold poorly in contrast to the PS360 versions. But did they sell enough to make the port break even / profit? This appears to be the wrong thread though, I'm pretty sure those two series don't do very well in Japan anyway.
How is it misleading? Even in Japan the the trend for TVs per household has been increasing since before the WiiU.
anexanhume
Member
Read the other posts but I'm still confused. Is this total approximate weekend HW sales? Does this include online like Amazon pre-orders?
pieatorium
Member
its just him guessing no need to try and get indepth for it
Just to point out as an anecdote, our family has five TVs at home, but three of them are old CRTs and of those, two aren't even hooked up and the other one gets used at most a few times a year since it's in the basement. Of the newer TVs, only one of them has a sound system hooked up in an open space and the other is in a small bedroom (so like playing Wii games would not make sense there). Not all TVs in the house are equivalent.
anexanhume
Member
I buy his extrapolations based on tie ratio. Just trying to reason how much of the market those numbers cover.
So obviously as an anecdote you're attempting to imply that your situation may be comparable to many other households, and this study did not care if the TVs were actually being used in the household, just how many old CRTs they had piled up in their basement? I guess we'll see a massive drop in the figures once everyone gets to dispose of their old CRTs. Well played Nintendo, your rivals never considered that.
Excellent point. It doesn't matter how many TVs you own, there's only so much multitasking possible unless every household member can do everything they want on their own dedicated TV. Any console that is used by more than one person will likely be plugged to a common room TV and therefore subject to usage conflicts.
In at least most western households kids have their own console on their own TV in their own room. That's how the vast majority of western households work. That's not an issue that western households need to change to fit Nintendo's idealised way of family life, Nintendo needs to change their product to appeal to the modern day western family.
PS4: The First Sales Data from Japan Is in from Major Retailer: PS4 Games do Well, but PS3 is on Top
http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02/23/ps4-the-first-sales-data-from-japan-is-in-from-major-retailer-ps4-games-do-well-but-ps3-is-on-top/
http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02/23/ps4-the-first-sales-data-from-japan-is-in-from-major-retailer-ps4-games-do-well-but-ps3-is-on-top/
metalslimer
Member
Dualshockers articlewith the usual clueless info.
shinra-bansho
Member
Why does dualshockers feel the need to make an article about every little thing... :/
Regardless of how many TVs people own or whether they move their consoles around them, the point is that it's not a pain point, at least not one sufficient enough to make "off-TV play" a particularly compelling selling point.
People aren't really sitting around scratching their heads looking for a solution to sharing their TVs better.
Regardless of how many TVs people own or whether they move their consoles around them, the point is that it's not a pain point, at least not one sufficient enough to make "off-TV play" a particularly compelling selling point.
People aren't really sitting around scratching their heads looking for a solution to sharing their TVs better.
ACIV did like 6,000 units first month NPD. The bulk of these types of games make a plurality if not a majority of their sales very early, and I think in the same way that first weekend receipts are important to film studios in terms of revenue share (?) game publishers may have similar arrangements with retailers. There's really no way to spin that sort of number into anything but abysmal.
I don't see how.
Activision isn't looking to break even when they invest $2M in a project.
metalslimer
Member
Seriously, it's pretty simple to understand that there is no reason for a publisher to invest a product they think is merely going to break even unless they actually believe the system it is on has a good future and plans on growing the base on that system later for much bigger profits. The CoD Wii ports probably more than justified their existence allowing them to be released every year with 0 marketing and making a nice profit. The Wii U CoD ports on the other hands seem like they are breaking even at best, honestly the number of people who want that version will only go down and not up as the Wii U fades out of the mainstream picture.
That's a point a lot of people seem to miss, Maybe they could get 50k sales on WiiU. If they don't release on WiiU then maybe 25k of those 50k will buy it on other platforms anyway. And if you don't intend to support that platform after then what's the point in transferring your customers to that platform anyway? Maybe that's 50k people who won't buy your next 5 iterations plus all DLC that you plan to release on other platforms. Of course Activision isn't stupid, no way they ever release another CoD on WiiU again.
Infinite Xero
Member
I wonder if Vita TV sales will increase significantly now that the PS4 has launch.
Felessan
Member
But people can move themselves to another TV set.
And having more than one TV set usually lead to specialization in those TV sets - one for kids room, one for main room, one for kitchen. And through this specialization competition for activity is greatly reduced - you don't watch you favorite TV show on kids TV, that mostly used for gaming.
This is the same info that had posted earlier in this thread. Nothing new.
pieatorium
Member
if sony was going to pr today i expect they would have done it already so it will probably be several hours till we get famitsu post
I was being subtle, in the assumption that you would pick it up, but my point is that statistics are a trap when the methodology involved is unknown or only attempts to extract information not directly applicable to the problem at hand. You are making the claim that household TV ownership statistics is evidence that there is no problem of sharing of TV resources in a household. What is missing here is actual usage of these TVs in the household, which varies on sound setup, location, hookup of inputs, the ease of changing outputs from the console and other devices, human preferences, etc., requirements that often vary based on purpose -- streaming, terrestrial broadcasts, movies, gaming, etc. What information you are attempting to extract and apply from this is how many TVs are actively used for gaming systems in the household, but this needs more rigorous debate based on the statistics you are providing.
I realize stating that AC4 on Wii U did okay is not a smart argument to make. Overall, I'm just expressing frustration that assumptions are simply accepted as fact. Hard figures would be nice once in a while. AC4 came out on Oct. 29th, so that NPD must not have had more than one week of sales.
You make it sound like it did less than 12K LTD (with you stating the majority of sales come very early). I'd wager it's closer to 45k. Add in other territories and it may have broken even or even been "worth it." "Abysmal" implies that Ubisoft lost their ass by doing the port. I'd sorta like to know what the numbers really are.
Where does my guess of 45k come from? Totally unscientific, but take a game's rating amount in the eShop and multiply it by 20. Compare it to NPD figures we know, and often times it tracks in the same ballpark. Probably x25 would be more accurate because each one I've listed below I believe is undershot, but it's an easy thing to do in your head while guesstimating:
3D World - 21864 x 20 = 437280
Sonic Lost World - 4074 x 20 = 81480
Wind Waker - 23211 x 20 = 464220
Wonderful 101 - 3829 x 20 = 76580
Rayman Legends - 4346 x 20 = 86920
Pikmin 3 - 12769 x 20 = 255380
metalslimer
Member
All right we will see then if the next AC comes out on Wii U.
Devilgunman
Member
Are we getting the first day number? It's already Monday afternoon in Japan, right?
That's not exactly my argument but AC on Wii U is going off on a tangent anyway. I'm just a little annoyed when power words like "abysmal" are thrown around as fact but if you ask anyone for figures, no one knows. Doesn't mean the poster is wrong, I might just be in a pissy mood.
yup, almost the end of the business day, I guess we have to wait for Wednesday
Black Republican
Member
How much are we expecting