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[jamesinclair]

My friend at Harmonix is willing to share this:

Lego Rock Band

Wii > DS> X360 > PS3

Or more specifically, when PS3 = x

5x > 4x> 2.5x > x


Not very detailed, but they just fired a lot of people, he doesn't want to be next :lol

 

[Arpharmd B]

Uncharted is not a Gears-level IP, and it probably never will be. You can blame marketing (stupid because this game had plenty of it), or something, but at the end of the day it's one of those amazing Sony games that failed to translate into a mega-hit.

Oh well. Accept it and move on.

 

[The Chef]

I am glad to see the GOW Collection doing so well. Sony needs as much incentive as possible to keep this HD remakes coming.

 

[duk]

Uncharted is not a Gears-level IP, and it probably never will be. You can blame marketing (stupid because this game had plenty of it), or something, but at the end of the day it's one of those amazing Sony games that failed to translate into a mega-hit.

Oh well. Accept it and move on.

blame can be split upon: not that popular of genre, ps3 owners and sony

 

[OldJadedGamer]

I don't get the unrealistic expectations for Uncharted. MW2 also outsold the nearest 360 game 6x over for the month.

There was a reason many publishers pushed their high-profile titles into Q1, and it sure as hell wasn't to duck Uncharted.

Selling 600-800k in a launch holiday window in the US is nothing to scoff at, it's in the same range as Mass Effect and Bioshock, and probably the most you can expect if your game a) isn't 30 hours long and b) isn't being purchased for multiplayer.

I doubt it would have outsold AC2 or L4D2 this month had it been released for 360 in the same period.

It's nothing to scoff at but it should have done better IMO. Rainbow Six Vegas 2, Army of Two, and MGS4 all were released in none holiday months and did the same sales. For some reason, even if the game quality makes it a "must own" title, Sony has a very hard time making gamers known of it.

Maybe it does just fall back to the poor community on the PS3 lack of information on the system. I'm not talking about web forums but when you turn the system on. The average 360 user is constantly aware of what is out or coming out where as the PS3 owner has to hunt this information down. While users praise the sleekness of the XMB I actually think it hurts sales of titles since no one knows what is going on. 360 users just seem more on the ball with current releases.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

It's nothing to scoff at but it should have done better IMO. Rainbow Six Vegas 2, Army of Two, and MGS4 all were released in none holiday months and did the same sales. For some reason, even if the game quality makes it a "must own" title, Sony has a very hard time making gamers known of it.

Maybe it does just fall back to the poor community on the PS3 lack of information on the system. I'm not talking about web forums but when you turn the system on. The average 360 user is constantly aware of what is out or coming out where as the PS3 owner has to hunt this information down. While users praise the sleekness of the XMB I actually think it hurts sales of titles since no one knows what is going on. 360 users just seem more on the ball with current releases.

Or maybe it's because Sony doesn't invest $40 million on marketing for a single game.

 

[elrechazado]

Or maybe it's because Sony doesn't invest $40 million on marketing for a single game.

only games with 30 million budgets sell more than uncharted. True story.

Nice edit from 30 to 40.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

I though JoshuaJSlone put this BS to rest last month. He posted data that shows 360 owners buy games at virtually the exact same rate as owners of the other consoles. I believe the number was 1 game per month per owner, for all 3 systems...I'll have to look, or maybe he'll show up and post it again. But whatever the number was, it was the same for all 3. It only looks like 360 owners buy more because of the limited data we get, and because there's such a hive mind phenomenon going on there, with so many owners buying the same games at the same time.

I think the number was about one game every three months, but yea this is completely true. The problem though is that there is zero analysis behind it. Unless I misinterpreted what he was doing, Wii Play and the insanely well performing Nintendo first party games probably diffuse what should be a clear userbase argument for the Wii. Both Nintendo and Sony offer extensive catalogs too, while MS seems to concentrate on annual blockbusters. 360 sales tend to be *incredibly* predictable too, especially compared to the Wii. Fuck, Two Worlds sold 100k in it's first month. Simply for being a wrpg.

Multiplayer shooters can do well as 360 exclusives, but most other genres (WRPGs, Fighters, Japanese-style action games, Sports titles, etc) are best off as multiplat on 360/PS3.

Don't be daft. All games are best off as multiplatform.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Or maybe it's because Sony doesn't invest $40 million on marketing for a single game.

Rainbow Six Vegas 2 and Army of Two each had $40 million marketing budgets?

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Nice edit from 30 to 40.

I thought Halo 3 had a $30 million budget, but I checked Wikipedia and it seems that it was $40 million instead.

And, yes, I used a hyperbole.

 

[Katana_Strikes]

Great sales for the GoW Collection. Hopefully, that'll mean more collections to come. Nice.

 

[D4Danger]

Or maybe it's because Sony doesn't invest $40 million on marketing for a single game.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

You gotta spend money to make money.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

Are we really back to the marketing thing? In the core market, games that focus on a short single player experience will never be huge like MW or Halo. Uncharted sales are fine.

 

[LegendofJoe]

I think uncharted's problem is branding. The name 'uncharted' isn't all that exciting or appealing. It doesn't imply adventure or mystery, it was a poor choice for a brand name in my opinion.

 

[-COOLIO-]

I think uncharted's problem is branding. The name 'uncharted' isn't all that exciting or appealing. It doesn't imply adventure or mystery, it was a poor choice for a brand name in my opinion.

it kinda implies both

 

[Son of Godzilla]

Hopefully, that'll mean more collections to come. Nice.

what is this i dont even...

Fuck, I can't even think about GoWC without feeling like a curmudgeon. I'll just be glad someone enjoys such things and leave it at that.

Are we really back to the marketing thing? In the core market, games that focus on a short single player experience will never be huge like MW or Halo. Uncharted sales are fine.

You know, I wonder how much not having a true co-op mode hurts games. People have been comparing UC2 to all these games that sold better, and I wonder if it's something as simple as that. Sure, nobody expected it to beat MW2, but why shouldn't it do as well as RE5 or whatever?

 

[DuckRacer]

My friend at Harmonix is willing to share this:

Lego Rock Band

Wii > DS> X360 > PS3

Or more specifically, when PS3 = x

5x > 4x> 2.5x > x


Not very detailed, but they just fired a lot of people, he doesn't want to be next :lol

Well, if that (and the 83k total figure posted earlier in the thread) is true:

Wii – 33,200
DS – 26,500
360 – 16,600
PS3 – 6,640

Oh boy. :lol

 

[elrechazado]

Well, if that (and the 83k total figure posted earlier in the thread) is true:

Wii – 33,200
DS – 26,500
360 – 16,600
PS3 – 6,640

Oh boy. :lol

pathetic heh

 

[Vast Inspiration]

blame can be split upon: not that popular of genre, ps3 owners and sony

What the fuck?

I think uncharted's problem is branding. It doesn't imply adventure or mystery, it was a poor choice for a brand name in my opinion.

WHAT THE FUCK?

Why do people say such stupid things?

 

[Son of Godzilla]

... I guess that probably doesn't include the Old Navy copies.

Speaking of which, well over 1000 stores each getting 60~70 copies... They might have given out more than the damn thing sold.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

it kinda implies both

:lol

If we're going to pick on ambiguous IP names let's start with Halo.

You know, I wonder how much not having a true co-op mode hurts games. People have been comparing UC2 to all these games that sold better, and I wonder if it's something as simple as that. Sure, nobody expected it to beat MW2, but why shouldn't it do as well as RE5 or whatever?

I think it's not being known for multiplayer in general. Games like MW2 and Halo are an excellent value because of their longevity. As much as it pains me to say it with U2 (my GOTY) you can get by with renting it.

 

[elrechazado]

:lol

If we're going to pick on ambiguous IP names let's start with Halo.





I think it's not being know for multiplayer. Games like MW2 and Halo are an excellent value because of their longevity. As much as it pains me to say it with U2 (my GOTY) you can get by with renting it.

Well, that explains why batman outsold it then. We could sit here and name dozens of worse games than uncharted that sold much much more, many that don't have a MP element. It's just not a game with a lot of penetration unfortunately.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

Did it beat the PS3 version (not total sales)? I believe the sales of both are similar. Besides, Batman is a much stronger IP.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

You say that like it's a bad thing.

You gotta spend money to make money.

I think that in the age of monster dev budgets that this is right. The only way that 1st party efforts are going to have a chance to make money is if your console is already so popular that you could leave all that work to 3rd parties anyway.

What you need are some games that can get your console such a good position and so you should either advertise your game to the moon or not bother even making it. Basically I just don't see the point of 1st party games that don't move consoles.

 

[elrechazado]

Did it beat the PS3 version (not total sales)? I believe the sales of both are similar. Besides, Batman is a much stronger IP.

in video games? Not really. Besides, that theory breaks down way too easily - wolverine is the most popular comic book character there is, why didn't that game outsell uncharted?

 

[Chrange]

Or maybe it's because Sony doesn't invest $40 million on marketing for a single game.

Really? So what do you think they spent? I constantly see the ads on TV, plus it's gotten a ton of magazine ads and if you go to a Wal-Mart it's on every TV there. You think that all comes free?

Uncharted was advertised heavily. The sales aren't a reflection of limited marketing :lol

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

in video games? Not really. Besides, that theory breaks down way too easily - wolverine is the most popular comic book character there is, why didn't that game outsell uncharted?

Yeah,, really. None of the games you are mentioning are blockbusters on the level of Halo and MW2 (what some on here are complaining about). They have similar sales tracks.

The only huge core gamer IP I can think of without multiplayer is Assassins Creed 1.

 

[elrechazado]

Yeah,, really. None of the games you are mentioning are blockbusters on the level of Halo and MW2 (what some on here are complaining about). They have similar sales tracks.

The only huge core gamer IP I can think of without multiplayer is Assassins Creed 1.

I don't think you really understood what I was saying.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

It's nothing to scoff at but it should have done better IMO. Rainbow Six Vegas 2, Army of Two, and MGS4 all were released in none holiday months and did the same sales. For some reason, even if the game quality makes it a "must own" title, Sony has a very hard time making gamers known of it.

Maybe it does just fall back to the poor community on the PS3 lack of information on the system. I'm not talking about web forums but when you turn the system on. The average 360 user is constantly aware of what is out or coming out where as the PS3 owner has to hunt this information down. While users praise the sleekness of the XMB I actually think it hurts sales of titles since no one knows what is going on. 360 users just seem more on the ball with current releases.

The only games on the list Psychotext posted that have had better debut months and didn't have a focus on multi (either non-existent or widely ignored), were

Assassin's Creed (360) 980k
Assassin's Creed 2 (360) 795k
Fable II (360) 790k
MGS4 (PS3) 775k
Star Wars TFU (360) 610k

Put in perspective, it had the 6th best opening of ANY non-multiplayer focused HD title in the entire generation in North America, and the second best on the console.

The only "problem" is that Sony's flagship 1st party IP doesn't speak to the demographic its console attracts, which largely wants games with competitive or co-operative online multiplayer.

 

[Kolgar]

I do think there's something unexciting about the Uncharted brand name that just fails to grab people.

The other hurdle for UC is the "everyman" lead character. Until you actually play the game, you don't realize just how cool and funny and charismatic Drake really is.

It's also an exclusive title on a third-place system in an environment that favors more shooter-oriented games featuring space marines, modern combat warriors, and zombies.

Beyond that... To me, Uncharted 2 too often feels claustrophobic. I feel more like I'm playing a rigidly scripted interactive movie than being totally immersed in the game world. This more than anything is likely the reason the series hasn't found the success some believe it should.

 

[Y2Kev]

Beyond that... To me, Uncharted 2 too often feels claustrophobic. I feel more like I'm playing a rigidly scripted interactive movie than being totally immersed in the game world. This more than anything is likely the reason the series hasn't found the success some believe it should.

But this defines Call of Duty more than anything-- tightly scripted, linear galleries.

I really just think it's the PS3.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

The only games on the list Psychotext posted that have had better debut months and didn't have a focus on multi (either non-existent or widely ignored), were

Assassin's Creed (360) 980k
Assassin's Creed 2 (360) 795k
Fable II (360) 790k
MGS4 (PS3) 775k
Star Wars TFU (360) 610k

Put in perspective, it had the 6th best opening of ANY non-multiplayer focused HD title in the entire generation in North America, and the second best on the console.

The only "problem" is that Sony's flagship 1st party IP doesn't speak to the demographic its console attracts, which largely wants games with competitive or co-operative online multiplayer.

I remember this list from the June 2008 NPD thread and I'm sure there are way more past this but as of 6/08 the current first months were:

Top First Month Sales in US, this gen:
1. Halo 3 - 3.3 million
2. SSBB - 2.7 million
3. GTA 4 360 - 1.85 million
4. CoD 4 360 - 1.57 million
5. Galaxy - 1.12 million
6. MK Wii - 1.12 million
7. Gears - 1.0 million
8. GTA IV PS3 - 1.0 million
9. Assassin's Creed 360 - 0.98 million
10. Madden NFL 08 360 - 0.89 million
11. MGS4 - 0.77 million
12. R6 Vegas 2 360 - 0.75 million
13. Wii Fit - 0.68 million
14. Army of Two 360 - 0.60 million
15. Madden NFL 07 360 - 0.57 million

 

[NIGHT-]

Great sales for the GoW Collection. Hopefully, that'll mean more collections to come. Nice.

QFT!

 

[LCfiner]

But this defines Call of Duty more than anything-- tightly scripted, linear galleries.

I really just think it's the PS3.

I disagree. I don’t think it would sell any better on the 360.

PS3 gamers will still buy up big titles just like 360 gamers. same attach ratio for all the big names, regardless of whether there’s multiplayer or not.

there’s just something about the uncharted IP that hasn’t clicked. I don’t think Drake fills the superman or militaristic fetish fantasy that appeals to the majority of gamers.

I love Uncharted and the world they come up with but the vibe the game gives off isn’t as appealing as other Sony IPs, like God of War or the MW2 juggernaut (even though I find MW2 to be rather dull)

 

[Kolgar]

there’s just something about the uncharted IP that hasn’t clicked. I don’t think Drake fills the superman or militaristic fetish fantasy that appeals to the majority of gamers.

I love Uncharted and the world they come up with but the vibe the game gives off isn’t as appealing as other Sony IPs, like God of War or the MW2 juggernaut (even though I find MW2 to be rather dull)

The bottom line may be that, consciously or unconsciously, too many people view the UC IP as simply a Tomb Raider knockoff with a dude.

 

[Road]

Well, if that (and the 83k total figure posted earlier in the thread) is true:

Wii – 33,200
DS – 26,500
360 – 16,600
PS3 – 6,640

Oh boy. :lol

I think there's a incongruence between what AniHawk said and "harmonix friend" said.

Band Hero total > Tony Hawk Ride total > Lego Rock Band total

60% of Band Hero sales are Wii sales. 60% of Lego Rock Band are Wii sales. The Wii version of Band Hero > all Lego Rock Band.

...Also, 60% of Tony Hawk Ride sales are Wii sales.

My friend at Harmonix is willing to share this:

Lego Rock Band

Wii > DS> X360 > PS3

Or more specifically, when PS3 = x

5x > 4x> 2.5x > x


Not very detailed, but they just fired a lot of people, he doesn't want to be next :lol

According to this guy, though, Wii had 40% of the sales. (5 / (5+4+2.5+1))

I guess we can only do so much with vague inequalities.

 

[Vast Inspiration]

Beyond that... To me, Uncharted 2 too often feels claustrophobic. I feel more like I'm playing a rigidly scripted interactive movie than being totally immersed in the game world. This more than anything is likely the reason the series hasn't found the success some believe it should.

Wow, when it comes to Uncharted, the stupid statements never seem to stop.
First of all, a tight, linear, directed experience is actually MUCH MUCH better in "immersing" a player. But I'll forgive that statement since people use that word for anything without any knowledge of what it means.

Hell, I can understand that YOU don't feel "immersed" in Uncharted, but it has nothing to do with the series success. If people played it...they'd like it. End of story. People just don't play it though. And this has to do with Sony not being able to convey WHY people should play Uncharted, and the PS3 userbase which just doesn't have that sense of community.

 

[Metal Gear?!]

I really hope Bioware cleans up with ME2....DA:O numbers aren't too hot and the way EA has been cleaning house lately really scares me. I felt for some time now that DA:O looked a little too traditional to really make a giant impact in 2009 and although it charted, these numbers would have me to believe that gamers have had their fill with that style of gameplay and aesthetic if it isn't in MMO form. Hope it did good on PC.

Dragon Age numbers are pretty low considering it had an entire month to accumulate those figures. I expect it to drop significantly next month considering it disappeared from the PAL charts rather quickly.

Over 550k without PC sales (provided your numbers are correct). I know PC retail is in the toilet, but I wonder if DA:O managed to hit 600k on NPD including PC. It most definitely did if you throw digital distribution in the mix.

Did you miss the dance of joy EA was doing this morning over selling 1m pieces of DLC for Dragon Age, I hardly think they are disappointed.

Given the 1 million DLC sales then I think it's safe to say that the PC version sold at least as well as the 360 and PS3 versions combined. Possibly twice as well? It's rare that every single owner would buy a piece of DLC.

I wish we could get PC numbers. The only thing I've heard was on a podcast a couple weeks back where Jeff Green said the PC version has sold extremely well. Espcially the digital copies. Over 600K is easily a lock, and probably much more than that.

Yep.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

You know, I wonder how much not having a true co-op mode hurts games. People have been comparing UC2 to all these games that sold better, and I wonder if it's something as simple as that. Sure, nobody expected it to beat MW2, but why shouldn't it do as well as RE5 or whatever?

Ummm, it might have something to do with the fact that Resident Evil is a huge franchise with a lot of history, while Uncharted isn't. There's no reason a relatively new franchise like Uncharted should be expected to do even close to as well as Resident Evil.

 

[stupei]

I think it's not being known for multiplayer in general. Games like MW2 and Halo are an excellent value because of their longevity. As much as it pains me to say it with U2 (my GOTY) you can get by with renting it.

The only huge core gamer IP I can think of without multiplayer is Assassins Creed 1.

I agree, Grand Theft Auto really did big numbers because of its multiplayer.

Uncharted was advertised heavily. The sales aren't a reflection of limited marketing :lol

No, not limited, just poorly done. If the ads they are running had been coupled with something actually targeted toward any of the games great qualities other than just "damn, so shiny!" it probably would have been much more successful. Save some of that money they spent running the ads nonstop during Thanksgiving weekend and stick one genuinely cinematic Uncharted 2 ad somewhere, anywhere. But instead they decided to cut corners by creating an ad for both the game and the system, except the game severely got the short end of the stick.

 

[Peff]

Given the 1 million DLC sales then I think it's safe to say that the PC version sold at least as well as the 360 and PS3 versions combined. Possibly twice as well? It's rare that every single owner would buy a piece of DLC.

They were probably including the two free pieces of DLC that are in the game too. Plus, that figure was worldwide, I think.

 

[Kolgar]

Wow, when it comes to Uncharted, the stupid statements never seem to stop.
First of all, a tight, linear, directed experience is actually MUCH MUCH better in "immersing" a player. But I'll forgive that statement since people use that word for anything without any knowledge of what it means.

Speak for yourself. But open-world games are kind of a big thing these days, and as I said, I personally feel constricted by the action in Uncharted.

Hell, I can understand that YOU don't feel "immersed" in Uncharted, but it has nothing to do with the series success. If people played it...they'd like it. End of story. People just don't play it though. And this has to do with Sony not being able to convey WHY people should play Uncharted, and the PS3 userbase which just doesn't have that sense of community.

Look, I was all excited to bring this game home and play the bejeezus out of it. But you know what? It didn't grab me. I found myself irritated by the too-linear gameplay, the too-predictable "I'm wandering around climbing about for a bit now before I reach the next big setpiece" style, and especially by the parts that had you falling off a train or otherwise dying for the nineteenth time in four minutes.

The game didn't grab me, and I put it down. I'm still not finished with it. It's just not one of those games that consumed me and compelled me to play.

That's a big problem, but it's not as big a problem as the "Tomb Raider with a dude" stigma the probably disinterests the mass market in the first place.

 

[stupei]

And you call me out for stupid statements?

Look, I was all excited to bring this game home and play the bejeezus out of it. But you know what? It didn't grab me. I found myself irritated by the too-linear gameplay, the too-predictable "I'm wandering around climbing about for a bit now before I reach the next big setpiece" style, and especially by the parts that had you falling off a train or otherwise dying for the nineteenth time in four minutes.

While the remark you're responding to is pretty stupid, there are a ton of heavily scripted games that sell like crazy. Sandbox is in but so is scripting if you make it "cinematic." I really don't think the style of gameplay explains the lack of mass popularity.

 

[markatisu]

I think there's a incongruence between what AniHawk said and "harmonix friend" said.

According to this guy, though, Wii had 40% of the sales. (5 / (5+4+2.5+1))

I guess we can only do so much with vague inequalities.

Does it really matter when the vagueness still tells the order and the fact sales were super low?

I mean we don't need a specific number to know how tanked a genre is

Interesting to see the Wii continues its reign over the music genre, just not at the levels of GHIII or GHWT. I guess if they can find a way to make a profit off a dedicated 100-150k (me being one of those as I just got DJ Hero and Band Hero last month lol) of buyers they will always have a niche in the userbase

 

[Son of Godzilla]

No, not limited, just poorly done. If the ads they are running had been coupled with something actually targeted toward any of the games great qualities other than just "damn, so shiny!" it probably would have been much more successful. Save some of that money they spent running the ads nonstop during Thanksgiving weekend and stick one genuinely cinematic Uncharted 2 ad somewhere, anywhere. But instead they decided to cut corners by creating an ad for both the game and the system, except the game severely got the short end of the stick.

Yea, as easy as it is to go back to that well, the ad for UC2 is terrible. It's 100% about the PS3 rebranding and fuck all to do with the game.

 

[Road]

Does it really matter when the vagueness still tells the order and the fact sales were super low?

It matters to me...



=P

Either way, thanks to the guys that provide these bits of additional info to us.

 

[Rhindle]

Yea, as easy as it is to go back to that well, the ad for UC2 is terrible. It's 100% about the PS3 rebranding and fuck all to do with the game.

Advertising is really not that critical for a sequel. That's why publishers love making sequels - they don't have to spend nearly as much on marketing.

Most people who were candidates to buy UC2 will have played UC1 at some point. They either liked it or didn't like it. Ads aren't going to sway the equation unless they're able to convey new information about the game. There wasn't much new to convey about UC2. It's pretty much the exact same game.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

I agree, Grand Theft Auto really did big numbers because of its multiplayer.

The difference is GTA has a shit ton of SP content.

 

[Vast Inspiration]

Speak for yourself. But open-world games are kind of a big thing these days, and as I said, I personally feel constricted by the action in Uncharted.

Look, I was all excited to bring this game home and play the bejeezus out of it. But you know what? It didn't grab me. I found myself irritated by the too-linear gameplay, the too-predictable "I'm wandering around climbing about for a bit now before I reach the next big setpiece" style, and especially by the parts that had you falling off a train or otherwise dying for the nineteenth time in four minutes.

The game didn't grab me, and I put it down. I'm still not finished with it. It's just not one of those games that consumed me and compelled me to play.

That's a big problem, but it's not as big a problem as the "Tomb Raider with a dude" stigma the probably disinterests the mass market in the first place.

Why don't YOU speak for yourself? Because you're not listening to what's being said. You are the miniscule minority. You're the one trying to make your problems with the game as the "major reason" why the game didn't do well.

A linear game has a lot more attention to detail and is more focused. And while immersion is subjective, I don't understand why its hard for you to see that people are usually more immersed when there's a directed experience. The bigger the game...the easier to see its flaws and realize that its just a a game.

 

[elrechazado]

Advertising is really not that critical for a sequel. That's why publishers love making sequels - they don't have to spend nearly as much on marketing.

Most people who were candidates to buy UC2 will have played UC1 at some point. They either liked it or didn't like it. Ads aren't going to sway the equation unless they're able to convey new information about the game. There wasn't much new to convey about UC2. It's pretty much the exact same game.

...the sales of uncharted 1 were terrible for how good of a game it was, and the idea that they were just going to say "fuckit, we'll just sell to people who played UC1 and call it a day" is really ridiculous.

Also, the idea that ads don't matter is funny.