Support NeoGAF

[Kazerei]

This is an interesting graph. So by the time we reach May 2012, 360 will have cut the Wii's lead by almost 4 million in two years. Assuming that the 720 (or whatever) launches next year, the 360 could get within 1-2M of the Wii LTD in the US. Would that be the closest console race ever in the US? How close were the SNES and Genesis?

There are only two logical ways to count a "gen": either count all the sales no matter when they occur, in which case you may have a late "winner" because a console drops out of the race (more or less) for whatever reason - this happened with the SNES/Genesis and could happen this gen.

Or you can decide what time frame the "gen" consists of, but that's arbitrary and you'll find it tough to get a consensus, especially when that will change who "won".

The Wii had its heyday, as did the Genesis, but the 360 could be the late "winner" by virtue of a strong finish, just like the SNES was.

Under the same rationale of ignoring sales post-launch of a new hardware generation...

Who "won" the 4th generation of home consoles..?

.

Anybody have SNES/Genesis hardware numbers on them?

I found this retro IGN article, which suggests the SNES did overtake Genesis before the Saturn launched in 1995. *shrugs*

Another thing to note is that SNES and Genesis lifespans were shifted by 1.5-2 years.

By 1994, SEGA had lost substantial ground to Nintendo in America. The two had been fairly close going into 1992, with Nintendo making strong gains against SEGA, thanks in no small part to the fact that every Super NES came with a copy of the acclaimed Super Mario World. According to market data, SEGA had a 55-percent share. But when SEGA started fracturing its audience with add-ons like the SEGA CD and 32X and Nintendo kept on producing triple-A games for its loyal fans, the battle was won. Nintendo pushed ahead of SEGA, which spent all of its 16-bit good will on the ill-fated Saturn.

Overall, I'd say it was a good tie between SNES and Genesis, and between Wii and Xbox 360 ... in North America. SNES and Wii clearly won worldwide.

 

[shinra-bansho]

They're releasing Wii U because they're well overdue for a new console. Microsoft is, too, but unlike Nintendo with Wii, Microsoft has only in the last few years actually been making a profit on 360, and they want their financial wounds to heal a little more before diving back in.

With the proposed price drop, are they really?

The Wii has collapsed. It's a 480p system in a now HD digital world.

The other two are seeing Y/Y declines, but not anywhere close to the Wii.

 

[donny2112]

No, it will still be the second place console because it will not pass the Wii before the Wii U is released.

That's really not my point, personally. I'm not trying to declare Wii the "winner" of this generation before 360 can pass it in one major territory. Frankly, there isn't really a winner of this generation, like there had been the previous two. Everyone has to have qualifications on their "winner" title this time around. :/

 

[Dalthien]

Aren't limited edition bundles specifically not counted inthe NPDs??

Lots of things are specifically not counted by NPD. NPD doesn't cover the entire market, so they estimate the sales for all the parts of the market that they don't cover. So everything that is sold in the retailers that NPD does not track will not get specifically counted - but those sales will be estimated by NPD, and included in their monthly report.

Basically, if any particular SKU gets sold at any of the retailers that NPD does track, then that SKU will be included in the monthly report with an estimate for the full market. If any particular SKU does not sell a single unit at any of the retailers that NPD tracks, then it won't show up in their monthly report.

 

[BKK]

You are very, very confused. No one is suggesting what you wrote. Last generation ceased being the interesting "race" once 360 was out. Whether GCN or Xbox sold more last generation after the 360 was already out was meaningless. If 360 passes up Wii a year after Wii U comes out to start a new generation, it will likewise not be the interesting race to watch, so those proclaiming "victory" at that point would be pretty pathetic.

Not confused at all, just pointing out how ludicrous it is to dictate one consoles' lifecycle based on the lifecycle of it's competitors. Nintendo had a strategy of targeting everybody from the beginning, whereas Microsoft and Sony had a strategy of targetting the core gamer at first, followed by the casual gamer later in the conoles lifecycle. Clearly this has necessitated a shorter lifecycle for Nintendo, whilst Microsoft and Sony can have a longer cycle whilst they continue with their strategy of late cycle sales to casual buyers.

What people are suggesting here is that Nintendo's strategy is the only legitimate one, and as such any sales from their competitors' longer lifecycle are irrelevant. I don't think this is reasonable or fair.

We'd all call them "pathetic."

They'd be making up an artificial race with completely ridiculous endpoints just to keep from being passed up by the supersonic Wii. That's not the case here. Nintendo isn't releasing Wii U because they want to hurry up and end the race before they can be passed up. They're releasing Wii U because they're well overdue for a new console. Microsoft is, too, but unlike Nintendo with Wii, Microsoft has only in the last few years actually been making a profit on 360, and they want their financial wounds to heal a little more before diving back in.

Who is this "we" you speak for? Nintendo are overdue a new console thanks to their different strategy than their competitors. The sales figures don't really support your assertion that Microsoft are well overdue for a new console.

If you want to celebrate if/when 360 passes up Wii long after Wii U (and maybe even 720) are on the market, go ahead. Won't change that it's a ridiculous reason to be celebrating.

Why would I want to celebrate? I don't even own a 360, but I don't think it's pathetic or ridiculous to consider that total sales over the whole console lifecycle dictate which console sold the most.

 

[donny2112]

Clearly this has necessitated a shorter lifecycle for Nintendo,

No. Lack of software support has clearly necessitated a shorter (than the other two) lifecycle for Nintendo. You can trace that back to their decision to not put out a system easily portable from the other two, but I don't think that directly ties into whether they targeted casuals or hardcore (or both) first.

I don't think it's pathetic or ridiculous to consider that total sales over the whole console lifecycle dictate which console sold the most.

Okay. GBA sold ~80m on the market. PSP sold ~70m on the market. Just looking at total hardware sales, you'd think they did about evenly. However GBA's was over ~4 years (mostly) and PSP's has been over ~7 years (mostly). Just want to know who sold the most in their lifetime? Sure, go with total numbers. However, ignoring context can sure leave you missing a lot of the real picture.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Why would continued examination of the current gen console sales after the Wii-U launches necessitate ignoring the context of those sales?

Also, I thought normalizing for years-on-market was frowned upon - PS3/360 debate.

 

[donny2112]

Why would continued examination of the current gen console sales after the Wii-U launches necessitate ignoring the context of those sales?

What I am calling 'pathetic' is waiting for the moment that 360 passes Wii in the U.S., well after Wii U comes out and possibly after 720 comes out, in order to declare 'victory' of 360 over Wii. I'm all for tracking numbers.

Also, I thought normalizing for years-on-market was frowned upon - PS3/360 debate.

When it's done in the PS3/360 case, it's usually a spin to put PS3 ahead when 360 is "really" ahead worldwide. There's definite worth in the comparison itself, particularly across generations. It's the spin that's usually frowned upon.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Lots of things are specifically not counted by NPD. NPD doesn't cover the entire market, so they estimate the sales for all the parts of the market that they don't cover. So everything that is sold in the retailers that NPD does not track will not get specifically counted - but those sales will be estimated by NPD, and included in their monthly report.

Basically, if any particular SKU gets sold at any of the retailers that NPD does track, then that SKU will be included in the monthly report with an estimate for the full market. If any particular SKU does not sell a single unit at any of the retailers that NPD tracks, then it won't show up in their monthly report.

What i meant is that they specifically separate limited editon skus from regular skus. they used to anyway.

 

[Dalthien]

What i meant, is that they specifically separate limited editon skus from regular skus. they used to anyway.

Yeah, every SKU is tracked separately.

 

[onipex]

Someone should probably inform the companies that any sales made after the next generation starts don't count. They're going to be pissed...

On a sincere note. I've never heard such garbage. The Wii and 360 will be in competition for as long as either of them is on sale. To release the successor because you can't sell your old model any more isn't considered the end of things.

Funny I saw the same thing mentioned last gen and it is just as sad to watch people hope for such a meager victory now as it was then.

 

[ShellyDeKiller]

Two things I forgot to point out:

• Wal-mart data is not yet included. I believe NPD will be perfectly clear when it is integrated.
• The listing of platforms in the top 10 chart is now confirmed to be ranked by unit sales. I know it's been a question in the past, but I confirmed it with NPD. (I'd asked several times before, but this time I got an answer!)

Nice to finally have a confirmation.

 

[Sagitario]

Abyss > Ocarina

Maybe that's the reason why I can't find a copy!

You can't find a copy because the shipment was small/limited.

 

[Mpl90]

Two things I forgot to point out:

• Wal-mart data is not yet included. I believe NPD will be perfectly clear when it is integrated.
• The listing of platforms in the top 10 chart is now confirmed to be ranked by unit sales. I know it's been a question in the past, but I confirmed it with NPD. (I'd asked several times before, but this time I got an answer!)

This means that last month, the second best selling Skylanders SKUs was the 3DS one, even more than 360. This IS interesting: it seems the mass children / teen audience is already starting finding its way on the platform, and so beginning to buy games, even more than on a much more established platform, where the game also found big success, as 360. Good.

 

[Version 3.0]

It's as pathetic as people rooting for more GameCube sales in 2006, so it could pass the Xbox after 360 came out. It made no difference then, and it'll make no difference now. The generation's over. The race is done. When one of the participants in the race ditches their old failing car to jump in a new shiny one, and the other participant eventually passes the old failing car sometime later, declaring victory just makes people stare at you funny.

I don't know about that. Last gen with the Xbox abandoned and the Gamecube still eking out a few sales, that was pathetic, sure. But this gen, the Wii is dying on its own, not due to abandonment to promote its successor, and the 360 is totally viable, enjoying a late surge. I don't think calling the race now is at all similar to calling the race then...and I admit, I was one of the ones cheering the poor Gamecube to pick up those few more sales.

 

[Hammer24]

The Xbox 360 ASP dropped $15 between January and February, from $299 to $284. PS3 went to $271.

I think we can pull two conclusions from this:
a) 300$ is now the mass market sweet spot. The 360 was selling its best year at this.
Planning the new gen I think Ninty will try to hit that price right from the start, to get the mass market from day one. MS and Sony will launch at 400$ with a clear cut roadmap to get to 300 as fast as technically possible.
b) A price cut makes no sense, neither to Sony nor to MS. I´d wager the price cuts will only come, when the next gen launch is right around the corner (around three months).

 

[pieatorium]

b) A price cut makes no sense, neither to Sony nor to MS. I´d wager the price cuts will only come, when the next gen launch is right around the corner (around three months).

I would bet on them cutting before/around the time of WiiU release.

 

[Hammer24]

I would bet on them cutting before/around the time of WiiU release.

Might on how much competition they see in Ninty.
If they see the WiiU as a direct threat to sales it might be a possibility. But I´d bet they´ll simply try to overshadow the WiiU launch by unveiling their nextgen concepts, going for the mindshare more than for the wallets.

 

[jvm]

I pinged the friendly person at Rentrak that helped me out before, because there was no update to their video game chart on Thursday. They sent over a spreadsheet of their rankings, including some things not published on their public site AFAICT. Like I said before, I really think they're pretty nice folks. Would love to know more about how much data they're working from and how refined their statistical work is.

Anyway, here's the sales chart for first full week in March.

1. (X360) Mass Effect 3 - EA Games
2. (PS3) Mass Effect 3 - EA Games
3. (PS3) Street Fighter X Tekken - Capcom
4. (PC) Mass Effect 3 - EA Games
5. (X360) Street Fighter X Tekken - Capcom
6. (PS3) MLB 12: The Show - SCEA
7. (X360) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - Activision
8. (X360) Major League Baseball 2K12 - 2K Games
9. (WII) Just Dance 3 - Ubisoft
10. (PS3) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - Activision

They sent over top 10 rented games and top 10 advertised games for the week as well.

 

[BKK]

I pinged the friendly person at Rentrak that helped me out before, because there was no update to their video game chart on Thursday. They sent over a spreadsheet of their rankings, including some things not published on their public site AFAICT. Like I said before, I really think they're pretty nice folks. Would love to know more about how much data they're working from and how refined their statistical work is.

Anyway, here's the sales chart for first full week in March.

1. (X360) Mass Effect 3 - EA Games
2. (PS3) Mass Effect 3 - EA Games
3. (PS3) Street Fighter X Tekken - Capcom
4. (PC) Mass Effect 3 - EA Games
5. (X360) Street Fighter X Tekken - Capcom
6. (PS3) MLB 12: The Show - SCEA
7. (X360) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - Activision
8. (X360) Major League Baseball 2K12 - 2K Games
9. (WII) Just Dance 3 - Ubisoft
10. (PS3) Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - Activision

They sent over top 10 rented games and top 10 advertised games for the week as well.

Thanks for posting, SFXT seems to have charted higher than it did in Europe.

 

[Nirolak]

Thanks for posting, SFXT seems to have charted higher than it did in Europe.

Thinking about this, our last known numbers for MLB: The Show are around ~350K, and generally the PC versions of games don't sell so hot at retail, meaning that SFxT could do fairly mediocre even if it gets the #2 spot for the month overall.

SF4 did 849K and MvC3 did 790.2K in their opening months, so they could hit a disappointment line pretty easily with that range.

 

[specialguy]

What I am calling 'pathetic' is waiting for the moment that 360 passes Wii in the U.S., well after Wii U comes out and possibly after 720 comes out, in order to declare 'victory' of 360 over Wii. I'm all for tracking numbers.

Why is that pathetic?

Frankly, the console that sells the most wins the generation and that'll be 360 (in the USA), at some point.

If the generation "ends" whenever anybody releases a new console, that's kind of unfair. Nintendo is releasing a new console because they HAVE to, theirs had weak legs. 360 will still be selling healthily when Wii U comes out. Why should the consoles that have better legs be penalized?

I dont know, I see value in both viewpoints. But you can be sure if 720 comes out a year earlier than PS4, and say PS3 is able to pass 360 in worldwide shipments because of it, everybody, or at least most everybody on GAF will declare that a win for PS3, and that PS3 was the 2nd place console.

It's a shame NPD stopped giving us PS2 numbers long ago, or I'd count those forever too.

Was the PS1 gen "over" the instant the Dreamcast came out? I dont know, but generally speaking I dont think so.

So when do we declare this gen over, for sales ranking purposes?

-when Wii U comes out?
-When XB720 and Wii U are out?
-When Xb720, Wii U, and PS4 are all out?
-Effectively, never, or until none are selling appreciable units?

I favor the 4th viewpoint, quite frankly.

And luckily, the order of finish isn't likely to change after a certain point anyway.

Luckily we WILL get shipment figures effectively forever, even if NPD stops for those slowing down consoles.

 

[BKK]

Thinking about this, our last known numbers for MLB: The Show are around ~350K, and generally the PC versions of games don't sell so hot at retail, meaning that SFxT could do fairly mediocre even if it gets the #2 spot for the month overall.

SF4 did 849K and MvC3 did 790.2K in their opening months, so they could hit a disappointment line pretty easily with that range.

Yeah, not suggesting that it's done well, just that it really bombed in Europe. UK did less than 1/4 of SF4, and UK is usually a good indicator as to whether a game will do well or poorly in the US. Based on that I'm not expecting it to get anywhere near SF4 in the US.

 

[iceatcs]

So when do we declare this gen over, for sales ranking purposes?

Everyone different.

Mine way, the day of this gen over is various to each company ie. Wii launch day to Wii U launch day is their Wii generation, DS to 3DS, PS3 to PS4 etc...
Use LTD for sale ranking for how fast sell pace. Best use for comparison, use YTD then.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Just saw the Asura numbers.
I know this is going to be an eye-rolling post, but oh well.

Regardless of how small the fanbase is, Legends 3 could have easily sold more units with a fraction of the budget of Asura. It really makes me wonder what this has them thinking over at Capcom at the moment. I'll really be interested on how Dragon's Dogma performs as well.

It's a shame too, because I really admire CC2's work, and the exec himself is a big supporter for the production of Legends 3. Really it's a lose-lose :/

 

[Cipherr]

Why is that pathetic?

Frankly, the console that sells the most wins the generation and that'll be 360 (in the USA), at some point.

Yes, that could be the 360 in the USA, but that wont win them the generation by any metric. A generational winner has always been based on who sold the most units worldwide. Its NEVER been decided on a single territory.

I'm willing to bet people are just a little confused. Wii will take the generation period, MS might get a single territory. /Shrug. One of those two accomplishments is a lot more desirable than the other. Especially considering how miniscule the margin will be in the U.S.

 

[jetjevons]

Yes, that could be the 360 in the USA, but that wont win them the generation by any metric. A generational winner has always been based on who sold the most units worldwide. Its NEVER been decided on a single territory.

I'm willing to bet people are just a little confused. Wii will take the generation period, MS might get a single territory. /Shrug. One of those two accomplishments is a lot more desirable than the other. Especially considering how miniscule the margin will be in the U.S.

Pretty sure this is NA sales thread.

 

[donny2112]

Why is that pathetic?

Already explained multiple times.

Keeping track of numbers and sales, I'm all for. Just want to say who sold more, right on. Declaring a "winner" of a generation after the previous leader has been out of the race for a couple of years? Pretty sad.

I guess if you just really hate the idea of Wii being the best-selling console in the U.S. during its life, you'd be fine waiting until a couple of years after its death to be able to dance on its corpse. That wouldn't change the idea that the celebration over "beating" a guy who left the race two years prior is still pretty sad.

 

[Psychotext]

I still don't see that argument. They're leaving the race because hardly anyone wants their console any more. If other consoles still have demand, then of course they would keep selling for longer... it's hardly like it's cheating. You could argue that it's better to sell 10m over 3 years than 10m over 6 years, but at the end of the day, they're both 10m.

It's like pulling out of a marathon and declaring you won even though you keeled over from sprinting the first 15 miles.

 

[Kangi]

Hard to win a race when the finish line keeps being moved.

 

[Hero]

I still don't see that argument. They're leaving the race because hardly anyone wants their console any more. If other consoles still have demand, then of course they would keep selling for longer... it's hardly like it's cheating. You could argue that it's better to sell 10m over 3 years than 10m over 6 years, but at the end of the day, they're both 10m.

It's like pulling out of a marathon and declaring you won even though you keeled over from sprinting the first 15 miles.

So in your FLAWLESS analogy what happens when one of the competitors has a year head start on the others then gets lapped by one of them for the next 5 years?

 

[Christine]

It hardly seems to matter except as a historical footnote. Xbox's meaningful victories don't depend on it and it's not necessary as evidence of Wii's failings. It won't happen in time to prevent Nintendo from claiming the #1 spot in their PR around Wii U launch; whether or not Microsoft can do the same in `13 is pretty irrelevant when they have so many other things to point to.

 

[Psychotext]

So in your FLAWLESS analogy what happens when one of the competitors has a year head start on the others then gets lapped by one of them for the next 5 years?

See that smiley... that means it was a joke. Lighten up.

Though I guess as Kangi says, with no finish line it's sort of all irrelevant anyway. History will obviously record what they all eventually sold from start of sale, to end of sale, so at least there's some finality there.

 

[bigtroyjon]

So in your FLAWLESS analogy what happens when one of the competitors has a year head start on the others then gets lapped by one of them for the next 5 years?

I don't think the WiiU will do that bad, lapped might be a harsh word.

 

[Cipherr]

Pretty sure this is NA sales thread.

Pretty sure he brings the discussion outside of the NA when he mentions the overall generation winner, something I addressed a page ago even.

Thanks for the drive-by though.

It hardly seems to matter except as a historical footnote. Xbox's meaningful victories don't depend on it and it's not necessary as evidence of Wii's failings. It won't happen in time to prevent Nintendo from claiming the #1 spot in their PR around Wii U launch; whether or not Microsoft can do the same in `13 is pretty irrelevant when they have so many other things to point to.

I agree with this, but still, a victory is a victory. The others are right tbh, I dont see why we would draw some imaginary finish line just because the WiiU launches. If the 360 takes NA even after the WiiU launch, then they take it, period. I dont see why anyone would see it differently.

 

[pieatorium]

Pretty sure he brings the discussion outside of the NA when he mentions the overall generation winner, something I addressed a page ago even.

Thanks for the drive-by though.

He didn't though he was speaking for the USA, you even qouted that part.

 

[Cipherr]

He didn't though he was speaking for the USA, you even qouted that part.

And you didnt understand what I posted because you are missing the context of the full conversation.

Go back a page and read this:

Not sure why people are arbitrarily cutting off the race when the next gen console launches. There's little doubt when all is said and done 360 will sell more hardware in the USA than Wii and PS3. I call that winning a generation.

But again, thanks for the post I guess. My post was driving that there is a very large difference between winning a generation and winning a territory. I dont see why this is so difficult to understand.

 

[Ashes]

Hard to win a race when the finish line keeps being moved.

It is.
That is of course unless you're the ps2. Or the DS. or nes, ps1, gameboy, etc etc...

Already explained multiple times.

Keeping track of numbers and sales, I'm all for. Just want to say who sold more, right on. Declaring a "winner" of a generation after the previous leader has been out of the race for a couple of years? Pretty sad.

I guess if you just really hate the idea of Wii being the best-selling console in the U.S. during its life, you'd be fine waiting until a couple of years after its death to be able to dance on its corpse. That wouldn't change the idea that the celebration over "beating" a guy who left the race two years prior is still pretty sad.

That presumes that nintendo will leave the race. And let us not forget, that the wii has lost momentum, shall we say. If they recapture the momentum with wiiU, then... wait, a sec, why am I even arguing this.

 

[pieatorium]

And you didnt understand what I posted because you are missing the context of the full conversation.

Go back a page and read this:



But again, thanks for the post I guess.

He is still talking about the US in that post, thanks for posting.

 

[Cipherr]

He is still talking about the US in that post, thanks for posting.

Actually the implication can be taken either way, which is why I replied and added clarity and distinguished the two from one another. I posted again on this page further highlighting the difference between the two to make it clear, assuming it wasnt already. Its not something he has directly responded to, but it is worth clarifying.

Go find something to do dude, stop trying to be witty, its not working.

 

[pieatorium]

Actually the implication can be taken either way, which is why I replied and added clarity and distinguished the two from one another. I posted again on this page further highlighting the difference between the two to make it clear, assuming it wasnt already. Its not something he has directly responded to, but it is worth clarifying.

Go find something to do dude, stop trying to be witty, its not working.

Why could it be taken any other way than talking about the US when he mentions the US specifically and this is the NPD thread? Should we clarify all talk about the games in this months top 10 incase someone gets confused and thinks we are talking about Japanese sales?

 

[Cipherr]

Why could it be taken any other way than talking about the US when he mentions the US specifically and this is the NPD thread? Should we clarify all talk about the games in this months top 10 incase someone gets confused and thinks we are talking about Japanese sales?

Because he very SPECIFICALLY references worldwide shipment numbers in the exact same post that he mentions the one who "Wins the generation" you genius. Had he not made that reference in the second post, after I mentioned the distinction in response to his first post, I too would have assumed that he was talking about the U.S. only, but when someone says

I dont know, I see value in both viewpoints. But you can be sure if 720 comes out a year earlier than PS4, and say PS3 is able to pass 360 in worldwide shipments because of it, everybody, or at least most everybody on GAF will declare that a win for PS3, and that PS3 was the 2nd place console.

in the same post that they say

So when do we declare this gen over, for sales ranking purposes?

Then there is more than enough room to post adding, or asking for clarification. You need to seriously back up off of me. Or at least read the full discussion before asking such an asinine question. You were better off doing the drive by post than trying to dig your heels in and assert that there's no concrete reason to clarify here. That's a battle you are going to lose.

 

[bigtroyjon]

You need to seriously back up off of me.

lol, funniest thing I've seen in an NPD thread in a long time. You are taking this way too seriously but this mini meltdown is good for laughs so do your thing.

 

[Cipherr]

lol, funniest thing I've seen in an NPD thread in a long time. You are taking this way too seriously but this mini meltdown is good for laughs so do your thing.

I'm sorry but he doesn't have a point. He is completely ignoring the fact that the only reason I mentioned worldwide in the second post is because the person I quoted mentioned it. Its like he isn't even reading the posts. And Im not sure why you consider this a meltdown, if you read my posts, I agree with Special. Making an imaginary cutoff date for counting the sales of consoles just to give the Wii a win is ridiculous. You either count who sold the most or you don't. Just because Nintendo is prepped to cut and run because their demand has dried up, doesn't mean MS's design and business plan suddenly becomes moot.

 

[pieatorium]

Because he very SPECIFICALLY references worldwide shipment numbers in the exact same post that he mentions the one who "Wins the generation" you genius. Had he not made that reference in the second post, after I mentioned the distinction in response to his first post, I too would have assumed that he was talking about the U.S. only, but when someone says

That was a SEPERATE part of the post regarding the worldwide "race" between 360 and PS3, the part you quoted and which started this discusion was specifically US Wii vs 360.

Then there is more than enough room to post adding, or asking for clarification. You need to seriously back up off of me. Or at least read the full discussion before asking such an asinine question. You were better off doing the drive by post than trying to dig your heels in and assert that there's no concrete reason to clarify here. That's a battle you are going to lose.

I think you might need to read his post again before going off the deep end and sniping comments at people.

 

[Cipherr]

That was a SEPERATE part of the post regarding the worldwide "race" between 360 and PS3, the part you quoted and which started this discusion was specifically US Wii vs 360.






I think you might need to read his post again before going off the deep end and sniping comments at people.

No it wasn't, it was all part of the same post, and it was a hypothetical situation he used to reinforce his viewpoint. This is why he referenced the PS4 (a console that doesn't exist yet), that part of the post was an example, a hypothetical "what if" that he equated to his POV on the subject of the generational sales and arbitrary cut off dates. Ironically you are the one who needs to read it again, which explains alot. Its all one thought, and its all one post, no page breaks, no re-quotes. Because of that I merely added some clarification, then went on to talk about the topic at hand.

 

[pieatorium]

No it wasn't, it was all part of the same post, and it was a hypothetical situation he used to reinforce his viewpoint moron. Read it again. Its all one thought, and its all one post, no page breaks, no re-quotes. Because of that I added some clarification, then went on to talk about the topic at hand.

Yes a Hypothetical viewpoint regarding the worldwide (which he uses that exact word) to reinforce his viewpont of the US (again specifically stating US). There is zero way to take it any other way and jumping in to add your clarification was completely unnecessary. Pretty mature to get down to name calling though.

 

[Cipherr]

Yes a Hypothetical viewpoint regarding the worldwide (which he uses that exact word) to reinforce his viewpont of the US (again specifically stating US).

I am most certainly hoping thats what he meant, I felt there was some ambiguity there so I clarified it. Then proceeded to join the discussion.

There is zero way to take it any other way and jumping in to add your clarification was completely unnecessary.

But this is where you lose it. There's nothing wrong with adding clarification when he on the previous page mentioned a generational winner in context that addressed solely the US and not worldwide data, which is what is actually used to determine who wins a generation,

And when in the second post he very clearly mentions worldwide data, then goes on to again mention the winner of a generation,

And especially when I tagged the post where I included the clarification with this:

I'm willing to bet people are just a little confused.

Further explaining why I felt said clarification was necessary. You want to argue in circles about semantics on something thats really pointless. And you aren't really adding to the discussion at all. I mean, the more I think about this, I could have run into this thread and said something about japan and left, and you still would just have to live with it.

I clarified a statement he made that I felt could have been confusing the people arguing with him. If you don't feel it was necessary, fine, live with it. But I'm done with you, your circular nonsense and the off-topic discussion.

 

[guek]

2011: 360 ~7 million Wii ~4.5 million Year-end game: ~5 million

2012: Clearly the Wii is going to decline more YoY than the 360, I think we all agree this, but let's pretend both lose 30% of their sales YoY: 360 ~4.9 million Wii ~3.1 million. Gap now ~3 million.

2013: Let's have the 360 lose another 30% of its sales, and we'll have the Wii drop to 1 million because it has been discontinued: 2013: 360 3.4 million Wii 1 million. Gap now ~1 million.

I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that the 360 passes the Wii lifetime, but I also don't think it's absurd.

I subscribe the the ideas put forth in this post.

And while the wii will probably be discarded like last generation's garbage, I can't help but wonder if there's something to Reggie's comments about how Wii U is meant to target a different demographic and how the two products are going to coexist. Some sharp new colors and a price cut to $99 combined with a decent amount of advertisement may prolong wii sales for longer than we'd expect.

But I'm probably just reading too far into what Reggie said. Probably...

 

[Cipherr]

I subscribe the the ideas put forth in this post.

And while the wii will probably be discarded like last generation's garbage, I can't help but wonder if there's something to Reggie's comments about how Wii U is meant to target a different demographic and how the two products are going to coexist. Some sharp new colors and a price cut to $99 combined with a decent amount of advertisement may prolong wii sales for longer than we'd expect.

But I'm probably just reading too far into what Reggie said. Probably...

I think so, they had a lot of trouble in 2011 just handling the Wii and the 3DS/DS and keeping the releases tight. I have no reason to believe they will be able to do any better with the WiiU/3DS and Wii on top of that. You have to really think about it, even if they want to keep the Wii alive, third parties arent going to. The Wii is no PS2, if they hope to keep the Wii selling, they would have to release games themselves for it.

Not going to happen. And with MS officially stating there will be no new Xbox hardware this year, I think that seals it for the 360 in the U.S. It will eventually pass the Wii. When the WiiU hits its going to murder the Wiis monthly sales. I don't see the Wii having much of a tail at all.