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[manueldelalas]

I don't think LBP is a bomb or anything, but I think the difference between the Rare games and LBP is that LBP had a huge marketing campaign. I don't recall ever seeing a single commercial for Viva or Banjo, but LBP had its own commercial, and then it appeared in a "list of PS3 games" commercial where the sackboy appeared at the end.

My assumption is that MS expects the Rare games to do well over a period of time, that they launched cheap and will remain priced that way probably until next January. By comparison, I think Sony was trying to make LBP into a system seller of sorts, but they'll probably have to wait until Gran Turismo 5 for that now.

Fixed, I don't think GoW3 is a system seller; it is a really popular game, but it has not proven it can sell systems.

The GT franchise on the other hand, is the one I hear the most about, be it from car enthusiasts to men in the 40's. The only reason Sony allows such an expensive and long development for this is because this is their most important franchise.

Sales wise, GT games sell 3 or more times the numbers of GoW.

Sad thing is that both games have little chance be released in 2009.

 

[yurinka]

Fixed, I don't think GoW3 is a system seller; it is a really popular game, but it has not proven it can sell systems.

The GT franchise on the other hand, is the one I hear the most about, be it from car enthusiasts to men in the 40's. The only reason Sony allows such an expensive and long development for this is because this is their most important franchise.

Sales wise, GT games sell 3 or more times the numbers of GoW.

Sad thing is that both games have little chance be released in 2009.

Gran Turismo series sold more than 50 millions units, it's Sony's strongest IP. But I think it's a system seller only for its fans.

 

[methane47]

Err, no?

It had several commercials on major networks running for a decent amount of time, tons of pre-release coverage, excellent post-release coverage, profiles of the developer, prominent placements in multiple Sony conferences, a well-publicized semi-public beta and tons of magazine advertising. That's just what I can see as a Canadian who doesn't intake much in the way of American media stuff.

Just because you watch the Daily Show and you didn't see ads for a game doesn't mean it's not being advertised.

Umm yeah.. Viva Pinata had a much larger ad campaign if I remember properly... Commercials on multiple networks specially the family networks .... CULMINATING IN ITS OWN FREAKING TV SHOW!!! BEFORE THE GAME LAUNCHED!! lol

Viva Pinata had its OWN TV SHOW!! ... thats pretty freaking huge if you ask me. And still today one of the biggest complaints of LBP is the lack of proper marketting

more proof

Fixed, I don't think GoW3 is a system seller; it is a really popular game, but it has not proven it can sell systems.

The GT franchise on the other hand, is the one I hear the most about, be it from car enthusiasts to men in the 40's. The only reason Sony allows such an expensive and long development for this is because this is their most important franchise.

Sales wise, GT games sell 3 or more times the numbers of GoW.

Sad thing is that both games have little chance be released in 2009.

I personally dont think that GT5 will have the support... They have done fan a huge disservice with all the broken promises and the stringing along... I for one am fed up with it... I probably won't even buy the game when it comes out... I have lost all interest in the game.

 

[bj00rn_]

Well, I call bullshit on that Microsoft claim. Assuming the 4 million sellthrough at the end of 2008 is correct it means the original only sold around 200k outside of the US in 2006.

Going upstream; It's so pointlessly futile - Unless you want to impregnate a fish or two.

 

[Cheebs]

What happened to Mario Galaxy's legs? NSMB is always in the DS top 10 it seems but SMG didn't even crack the top 20 for Wii. Which is odd cause that is very much a crossover game. NSMB was a hit with the "non-gamers" as much as the gamers I would assume the same for Mario Galaxy but it didn't seem to really have any legs at all. It is easily the best Mario platformer in over a decade, it is sad to see it not really catch on like NSMB.

Umm yeah.. Viva Pinata had a much larger ad campaign if I remember properly... Commercials on multiple networks specially the family networks .... CULMINATING IN ITS OWN FREAKING TV SHOW!!! BEFORE THE GAME LAUNCHED!! lol

Viva Pinata had its OWN TV SHOW!! ... thats pretty freaking huge if you ask me. And still today one of the biggest complaints of LBP is the lack of proper marketting

Yeah MS went all out for Viva Pinata. They were basically trying to market it as the new Pokemon.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

Banjo did have a commercial.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=CxukU-n8o6g

 

[Grecco]

I don't think LBP is a bomb or anything, but I think the difference between the Rare games and LBP is that LBP had a huge marketing campaign. I don't recall ever seeing a single commercial for Viva or Banjo, but LBP had its own commercial, and then it appeared in a "list of PS3 games" commercial where the sackboy appeared at the end.

My assumption is that MS expects the Rare games to do well over a period of time, that they launched cheap and will remain priced that way probably until next January. By comparison, I think Sony was trying to make LBP into a system seller of sorts, but they'll probably have to wait until God of War 3 for that now.


EDIT: that must be a different game.

Banjo had TV ads. Not at the level of LBP but more than your typical game and more than Viva Pinata TIP did.

you're kidding.

Err no hes not. In fact LBP has had so far a much better advertisal campaign than KZ2 but Killzone has a month left.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

LittleBigPlanet has done better than any of Microsoft's "similarly themed" offerings over the past couple of years (and much better than Viva Pinata/Banjo did at a much lower price), so it's encouraging to see it do quite well for itself even if it's not an instant million seller or anything (which the product was never going to be, given that it's a new IP on a platform where the genre isn't exactly a perfect match).

It's the shooter box limbo. How low can your expectations go?

 

[Link]

Even still, it's second month was about 70k less than it predecessor. I don't think that was really expected.

I don't see the problem with that. Sequels are always much more frontloaded compared their predecessors. 70k isn't even that high a number when you're talking about 745k units sold.

Honestly I doubt it, fps on Wii are too few and Red Steel 1 had so much potential...

Well, see, it'll be hard for Red Steel 2 to sell many copies considering it's never going to be released.

 

[CTLance]

Can we get a comment from Gazunta on the subject of the Wii Nerf game? IIRC he was involved in the development of the game...

Also, THANK YOU SUPREME BEINGS at whoever released the Top20&per-platform Top10. This was sorely needed, after months and months of meager data finally something to put everything in perspective... sort of.

 

[John Dunbar]

Also, THANK YOU SUPREME BEINGS at whoever released the Top20&per-platform Top10. This was sorely needed, after months and months of meager data finally something to put everything in perspective... sort of.

Haven't those been released almost every month? I know that at least top 20 has been in Gamasutra's NPD analysis.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

Haven't those been released almost every month? I know that at least top 20 has been in Gamasutra's NPD analysis.

I think in the past few months we got that top 20 and a platform top 10 or 2 but not all of them.

 

[CTLance]

I think in the past few months we got that top 20 and a platform top 10 or 2 but not all of them.

Yah, I probably should've chosen my words better. So, TYSB for giving us all data sets in one go.

 

[squatingyeti]

The only real huge disappointment from Sony's side is the performance of R2, honestly.

LittleBigPlanet has done better than any of Microsoft's "similarly themed" offerings over the past couple of years (and much better than Viva Pinata/Banjo did at a much lower price), so it's encouraging to see it do quite well for itself even if it's not an instant million seller or anything (which the product was never going to be, given that it's a new IP on a platform where the genre isn't exactly a perfect match).

MotorStorm 2 was doomed from the start. PGR4 did really bad last year. The writing was on the wall that MS2 wouldn't be a huge seller either. These games only do well during launch periods.

But Resistance 2 just seemed to get ignored with all the shooters released this fall. Gears 2. L4D. CoD: WaW. On paper, the game should have done much better. Campaign mode, 60 player online, 8 player co-op. It also reviewed fairly well. Despite that, it got overlooked. There seemed to be some hardcore backlash against the title which may be responsible for its rather low sales. It should have done much better than it actually ended up doing.

I guess you're right, if we ignore the large price slashing on LBP very quickly after release. Screw it, NVM. I know it's pointless having rational discussion about Sony with Hans.

 

[Dalauz]

NDS MARIO KART 1.65M


HIGHLANDER

 

[WrathOfOtaibah]

Glad to see that the Year of the PS3 ended so triumphantly

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Can we get a comment from Gazunta on the subject of the Wii Nerf game? IIRC he was involved in the development of the game...

I can't say for sure that he wasn't, but Wikipedia says it was developed at EA Salt Lake, and I believe he's at Krome Studios in Australia.

 

[selig]

LittleBigPlanet has done better than any of Microsoft's "similarly themed" offerings over the past couple of years (and much better than Viva Pinata/Banjo did at a much lower price), so it's encouraging to see it do quite well for itself even if it's not an instant million seller or anything (which the product was never going to be, given that it's a new IP on a platform where the genre isn't exactly a perfect match).

Could you stop that?
With all that marketing and hype LBP got you can still say that it never was an instant million seller? With a straight face? I also like how you worded this sentence. LBP is not gonna have legs, it didnt show them this month, and there´s no reason to believe that it will develop any.
What im most curious about, though, is what you mean with that last sentence of your´s. I guess platformers are a Wii-exclusive genre now, or which other console would LBP match? Nonsense, past Sony-consoles always had many of these colorful games, and they did well.

And i dont know if that was you, but i loved how someone in here wrote, that basically motion-controls will be great as soon as they´re not from Nintendo. Looking forward to nextgen where everyone suddenly likes what the Wii did 5 years prior.

 

[Jocchan]

I can't say for sure that he wasn't, but Wikipedia says it was developed at EA Salt Lake, and I believe he's at Krome Studios in Australia.

IIRC the boxart was made by a GAFfer (not Gazunta).

 

[TJ Spyke]

Could you stop that?
With all that marketing and hype LBP got you can still say that it never was an instant million seller? With a straight face? I also like how you worded this sentence. LBP is not gonna have legs, it didnt show them this month, and there´s no reason to believe that it will develop any.

Especially since Sony made it clear that LittleBigPlanet was supposed to be their big holiday hit.

 

[oldergamer]

I guess you're right, if we ignore the large price slashing on LBP very quickly after release. Screw it, NVM. I know it's pointless having rational discussion about Sony with Hans.

So true. It's good to see people are catching on it's Hans. His broken logic is beyond annoying.

For one thing, didn't viva pinata sell decently well worldwide when it was all said and done? I'm not sure what the numbers were, but I think MS was more interested in developing new IP then they are worried about sales of those titles (That's why a TV show was developed). Also, neither title was pushed as a big holiday release on 360. Sony pushed LBP as "the biggest" title they were releasing for 2008.

LBP hasn't reached a million units in the biggest individual markets out there. Worldwide it may break even, I'm not really certain, however it hasn't sold well enough to see if a sequel will be necessary. LBP had a HUGE marketing campaign compared to the rare titles. Hans uses some broken logic indeed.

 

[Link]

For one thing, didn't the viva pinata sell decently well worldwide when it was all said and done?

That was mostly because it started being bundled with the hardware.

 

[oldergamer]

That was mostly because it started being bundled with the hardware.

Hasn't Sony been doing the same thing?

 

[John Dunbar]

Other than him being a Sony fanthing, is there any reason to assume Hoffman is Hans? I'm pretty sure Sony still has more than one fanboy.

 

[Lebron]

For one thing, didn't viva pinata sell decently well worldwide when it was all said and done?

It did eventually sell over a million, I believe. Granted they did bundle it and what not, but still, million is a million.
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/rare-our-future-products-will-surprise-people

"It's been somewhat of a struggle at times - we did Kameo and Viva Pinata, and people often ask me if VP was a success, and I point out that it sold a million units for a game in which you're gardening, hunting and attracting animals on a box that people would see - if you ask the general public, they'll see it as a shooter box, or a hardcore box.

 

[oldergamer]

Other than him being a Sony fanthing, is there any reason to assume Hoffman is Hans? I'm pretty sure Sony still has more than one fanboy.

Yes, anyone that has read *** ages forums will be familiar with his arguments. It's one thing for people to share an opinion on something, that happens all the time, but it's totally different when two people say the exact same things word for word. It's him...

 

[oldergamer]

It did eventually sell over a million, I believe. Granted they did bundle it and what not, but still, million is a million.
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/rare-our-future-products-will-surprise-people

Thank you, I knew there was a sales quote out there... If Viva was a title MS pushed as the biggest title they were releasing that year, then even a million units would have been considered a flop. Big titles for the holiday season need to be "big" enough to move consoles, such as a Gears of War, Halo, MGS4, etc... LBP, didn't hit that mark.

 

[Link]

Hasn't Sony been doing the same thing?

I'm not arguing that point.

 

[Azelover]

What happened to Mario Galaxy's legs? NSMB is always in the DS top 10 it seems but SMG didn't even crack the top 20 for Wii. Which is odd cause that is very much a crossover game. NSMB was a hit with the "non-gamers" as much as the gamers I would assume the same for Mario Galaxy but it didn't seem to really have any legs at all. It is easily the best Mario platformer in over a decade, it is sad to see it not really catch on like NSMB.

Just because you like Mario Galaxy doesn't mean everyone does, there are a lot of barriers to SMG. Most people like 2D Mario, so please don't compare 3D Mario with it, they're two very different series.

 

[ViperVisor]

There are lots of kids that don't remember Mario like we do.

Mario 64 was a phenomenon but that was 12 years ago. Sunshine sold to the GameCube audience but that was a modest total. So you could be a senior in HS and never remember Mario being the greatest gaming icon with the substance worthy of that.

 

[Cheebs]

Just because you like Mario Galaxy doesn't mean everyone does, there are a lot of barriers to SMG. Most people like 2D Mario, so please don't compare 3D Mario with it, they're two very different series.

Yeah but compared to Mario 64 and Mario Sunshine not just the 2D ones the thing has weak legs. Obviously it will outsell Sunshine in the end but it was A LOT more front loaded than Sunshine was. I remember sunshine topping gamecube charts for most of the systems life. The front-loaded nature of Galaxy really shows that the game sold to the hardcore and not the casual's. It's more similar to something like Zelda in that way than traditional Mario games. Which I can't recall ever happening before. Mario Sunshine had a rather average opening month but sold consistently the entire life of GameCube.

There are lots of kids that don't remember Mario like we do.

Mario 64 was a phenomenon but that was 12 years ago. Sunshine sold to the GameCube audience but that was a modest total. So you could be a senior in HS and never remember Mario being the greatest gaming icon with the substance worthy of that.

No that's not really the case I think. Mario is still extremely powerful of an icon. Mario Kart sells shitloads, and the 2D mario's like New Super Mario Bros. are gigantic hits. It's the 3D Mario this generation that suffers which is really quite sad since that is by far the best game with Mario's name on it out right now. NSMB doubling Mario Galaxy is quite something.

 

[donny2112]

It would be an interesting project to "NPDize" the MC numbers, just to get a grip on how distorted our view of the US market is.

http://gameinfo.yahoo.co.jp/ranking/monthly_sales.html

There's the November Top 20 for Japan (Famitsu). #20 sold 80K. I'm pretty sure there were more than 20 games > 100K in November's NPD numbers, for comparison.

LIAR!

CHEAP! CHEAP LIES!

It's only selling because of price. That's why the 360 started outselling it.

Of course. That's also why the GameCube dominated the last console generation. Price is King, Baby!

 

[markatisu]

What happened to Mario Galaxy's legs? NSMB is always in the DS top 10 it seems but SMG didn't even crack the top 20 for Wii. Which is odd cause that is very much a crossover game. NSMB was a hit with the "non-gamers" as much as the gamers I would assume the same for Mario Galaxy but it didn't seem to really have any legs at all. It is easily the best Mario platformer in over a decade, it is sad to see it not really catch on like NSMB.

You do realize that Mario Galaxy has sold a TON don't you?

Its "legs" could exist but we wont see due to the way the charts work

Even at 50k or so a month you are taking about an additional 600-700k a year which would add to the already massive sales it had over the life of the system

Also you have to keep in mind the audience for Mario Galaxy is very different then NSMB, a lot of people are still intimidated by a 3-D Mario Game regardless of the excellent controls and feel of Mario Galaxy.

 

[ViperVisor]

Mario Kart is just a genre people really like. It and its spin-off have been huge sellers for years and years also being party/multi-player helps.

NSMB on DS is selling more to that audience that played and remembers Mario in 2D.

3D Mario was always a step too far for some and they didn't like how it played out. Sunshine even with the sales probably soured some that liked Mario in 3D; lack of world variety and fludd.

 

[Cheebs]

You do realize that Mario Galaxy has sold a TON don't you?

Its "legs" could exist but we wont see due to the way the charts work

Even at 50k or so a month you are taking about an additional 600-700k a year which would add to the already massive sales it had over the life of the system

Also you have to keep in mind the audience for Mario Galaxy is very different then NSMB, a lot of people are still intimidated by a 3-D Mario Game regardless of the excellent controls and feel of Mario Galaxy.

Oh of course it sold a ton, I am just comparing it to NSMB. I get why it won't ever touch NSMB, it's just disappointing. I really wish Mario Galaxy connected with the non-core audience like NSMB did, it is by far the best Mario in such a long time it just really deserved the type of success NSMB got.

Is it possible for Nintendo to ever have the Mario 3D franchise breakout like the 2D ones? I really can't see how.

 

[donny2112]

tip- stop using CoD to prove your point.

I love that it was shellacked in November and used as "proof" that third-party multi-platform FPSs won't sell on Wii, and then it shows up at #19 in the December Top 20. :lol

 

[markatisu]

Is it possible for Nintendo to ever have the Mario 3D franchise breakout like the 2D ones? I really can't see how.

There are also other factors, price is one of them.

Release a platinum version of Mario Galaxy at $29.99 and give it a 2nd market push (as most DS games get, I mean we are seeing brand new commercials for Mario Kart DS and look where it entered the Top 10) and I think you will see the title reappear

A console Mario can sell massively, just make NSMB for Wii :lol

 

[donny2112]

There are three factors which determine what titles will appear on top sales lists: installed base,

GameCube games routinely made the NPD Top 10.

attach rate,

Which obviously explains why the PSP had two games make the Top 10 this year in the U.S., since it has just a top-notch attach rate.

and number of available games of any given performance level.

So games that sell a lot are a factor in which games appear on a "top sales" list? What an interesting revelation.

Sony could have as many blockbuster games, a higher attach rate, and still not crack the sales charts due to the roughly 3:2:1 installed base advantage of Wii and 360.

:lol Yeah, that's the reason for why COD was in the Top 10 for November and December.

(Their attach rate seems to be about on par with Wii.)

PS3's attach rate should have been higher than the Wii's through November. December would've raised the Wii's tie ratio up a lot, though.

Edit:

NSMB is always in the DS top 10 it seems but SMG didn't even crack the top 20 for Wii.

We have a Top 20 for Wii? Please share.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Of course. That's also why the GameCube dominated the last console generation. Price is King, Baby!

THIS MAN GETS IT!!!

WHY AM I SHOUTING?!

BECAUSE I AM EXCITED!

HD WINS, WAGGLE FAILS!

*masturbates furiously*

 

[P90]

I'm hoping all the gaming platforms are successful with excellent content. What is good for Nintendo, MS and Sony is good for me. I own stock for each of them.

 

[NintendosBooger]

I'm still surprised that Nintendo hasn't developed an all-star first-person shooter game along the same vein as Mario Kart and Smash Bros, considering the enormous popularity of first-person games in two major markets. The Big N seems to have a great answer for every major and popular genre out there save for that one.

 

[Threi]

I'm still surprised that Nintendo hasn't developed an all-star first-person shooter game along the same vein as Mario Kart and Smash Bros, considering the enormous popularity of first-person games in two major markets. The Big N seems to have a great answer for every major and popular genre out there save for that one.

Spoiler

Yes, it is close enough to a FPS to be counted.

 

[Jokeropia]

Obviously it will outsell Sunshine in the end

In the US, it did that by February 2008. Worldwide, it did it by March 08.

 

[PhoenixDark]

I'm still surprised that Nintendo hasn't developed an all-star first-person shooter game along the same vein as Mario Kart and Smash Bros, considering the enormous popularity of first-person games in two major markets. The Big N seems to have a great answer for every major and popular genre out there save for that one.

Mario Paintball

 

[manueldelalas]

I'm still surprised that Nintendo hasn't developed an all-star first-person shooter game along the same vein as Mario Kart and Smash Bros, considering the enormous popularity of first-person games in two major markets. The Big N seems to have a great answer for every major and popular genre out there save for that one.

Metroid Prime.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

PS3's attach rate should have been higher than the Wii's through November. December would've raised the Wii's tie ratio up a lot, though.

Would it? Remember, months where userbase jumps drastically are harder to even keep tie ratio even.

Let's see... I don't know Wii's tie ratio after November, but it looks like it was 5.5 after September, so I'll use that for illustration. If it was 5.5 after November, it would need 11.8 million software sales to break even.

 

[Dirtbag]

The only real huge disappointment from Sony's side is the performance of R2, honestly.

No, not selling a million console units in the best sales month of the year (being out sold 2-1 by MS and 3-1 by Nintendo) and then only having a single game crack the top ten sales for the month - eeking in at just over 500k in DECEMBER are much larger disappointments.

 

[Mrbob]

Heard some numbers on the IGN Gamescoop podcast for Rock Band..

Rock Band 1 sold 800K in 2008 on 360
Rock Band 1 sold 375K in 2008 on PS3
Rock Band 2 sold 600K in 2008 on 360
Rock Band 2 sold 183K in 2008 on PS3

Rock Band 2 Wii sold 150K in Dec 2008

I know RB2 released middle of the month on Wii, but it looks like GH is flexing its muscle as the music game of choice for casuals considering it sold 850K.

 

[NintendosBooger]

The Metroid Prime games are great, but they're not too accessible. They're not fun, multiplayer madness games like Mario Kart and Smash.

 

[Dirtbag]

Did the top 20 software sales for the month get posted in this thread somewhere already?
I'd like to see them.