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Has the DS won already?

MINI-GAMES!!!!11111

It's the new GAF jaded gamer fad! What's next -- virtual puppies? awkwardly scribbling out text messages to folks within earshot?

How long until some of you folks just admit that you've been loathing gaming ever since the Nintendo brand name began its slow, steady slide into cultural irrelevance?

"come on, nintendo, we need something new that we can really call our own! we've been deprived of our sense of subculture superiority for far too long! go ds!"
 

paul777

Banned
Belfast said:
I'm talking about brand appeal, son. They're servicing patently different markets, but the tactics used to sell both (sleek, sexy, and functional) have driven people to eschew the cost based solely upon looks and tech appeal. You've got to be kidding yourself if you think the iPod isn't the "hot" thing currently and Sony stands to expect the same kind of consumer and media attention that Apple's little toy currently enjoys.

Dubious. The ipod excels in its simplicity and elegance. PSP is convoluted and uninviting to the nongamer. Watching movies on it is uncomfortable and about as elegant as sidetalking on an N-gage.
 
Drinky Crow said:
MINI-GAMES!!!!11111

It's the new GAF jaded gamer fad! What's next -- virtual puppies? awkwardly scribbling out text messages to folks within earshot?

How long until some of you folks just admit that you really hate gaming ever since the Nintendo brand name began its slow, steady slide into cultural irrelevance?


Post content = 0

So the DS will have no good games ever and the PSP games fell from heaven. And when the innovatve DS titles hit, what then?

Complain about their use of the color mauve? :lol

I love gaming. I'm the one who doesn't have an irrational loathing of one of the most innovative companies in gaming, remember?

I own and love all my games - no matter what console they are on. You for some ungodly reason take pleasure in gleefully mindlessly bashing with zero reason.
 
"Dubious. The ipod excels in its simplicity and elegance. PSP is convoluted and uninviting to the nongamer. Watching movies on it is uncomfortable and about as elegant as sidetalking on an N-gage."

I was agreeing with you till your last point. Watching movies on this thing will be great (and easy to do if you were to buy one on a UMD). Music playback might be a bit of a hassle, but that's up to Sony's firmare upgrades.
 

maharg

idspispopd
The really funny thing about this thread is that, either way, the "xxxxx FANS EAT CROW" thread that will result from it will kick the ass of the halo 2 crow thread six ways from sunday.
 

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
what the ds really needs is some insert credit types to rationalize its frankly disfigured ideas. the mute pliancy of the classical nintendo fan is getting boring. from now on i'm going to call the ds a "joycean transfiguration of the mundane, of the neglected, of the execrated."

...

MINI-GAMES!!!!!111
 
krypt0nian said:
Yes especially when it single-handedly got non-gamers to *gasp* play a handheld for the first time in their lives. I cannot tell you how many non-gamers I've stunned with it. You wouldn't care anyway obviously.

I guess expanding the overall audience isn't as a huge concept as more of the same + portable but to each their own.
I guess you missed my point (or are ignoring it). It's sad that a system that Nintendo developed themselves that offers a truly unique game play feature doesn't even get a launch title by said company to showcase it. Instead a 3rd party does this. What if Feel The Magic didn't make launch or *gasp* didn't exist at all? Nintendo's own launch efforts in no way showed any real innovative gameplay for their new innovative portable. Don't you find something wrong with this picture (if only just a little)? It'd be different if we weren't talking about Nintendo here but we are.
 

Belfast

Member
paul777 said:
Dubious. The ipod excels in its simplicity and elegance. PSP is convoluted and uninviting to the nongamer. Watching movies on it is uncomfortable and about as elegant as sidetalking on an N-gage.

Right. Well then. I guess that about wraps it up for *my* argument. Guess everybody likes shifting their attention between two screens all the while fumbling around with a finger-cramping stylus in a desperate attempt to shoot down bom-ombs or whatever crazy (mini)game you kids like to play these days.

Edit: MINI-GAMES!!!111
 

Amir0x

Banned
Pedigree Chum said:
Music playback might be a bit of a hassle, but that's up to Sony's firmare upgrades.

Are you sure you're up to date on the PSP? Playing mp3s on your PSP is as easy as dropping them into a folder on your PC. Literally.
 

Amir0x

Banned
lockii said:
Haters and Fans unite! Can we all agree the IGN Editors pic is brilliance?

*sniff* Did you read my post toward the end of the 4th page? Nobody read it and I need encouragement ;)
 
Belfast said:
Right. Well then. I guess that about wraps it up for *my* argument. Guess everybody likes shifting their attention between two screens all the while fumbling around with a finger-cramping stylus in a desperate attempt to shoot down bom-ombs or whatever crazy (mini)game you kids like to play these days.

Edit: MINI-GAMES!!!111


Who's "shifting attention"? - where do you get this crap?

EDIT: Loading times! See how stupid that is?
 
The DS *is* inviting to the non-gamer -- why, I imagine any ONE of these DS pulpiteers could concoct you FIVE likely anecdotes about how Feel The Magic made a great-aunt drop $150 for the chance to rub a stylus on a touch screen!
 
Drinky Crow said:
The DS *is* inviting to the non-gamer -- why, I imagine any ONE of these DS pulpiteers could concoct you FIVE likely antidotes about how Feel The Magic made a great-aunt drop $150 for the chance to rub a stylus on a touch screen!


Damn you are desperate. Now you get to counter arguements that you feel in the ether. :lol


You were right....someone here hates gaming all right. Or has become so jaded that they find more pleasure in hating than gaming.
 
Drinky Crow said:
I imagine any ONE of these DS pulpiteers could concoct you FIVE likely antidotes about how Feel The Magic made a great-aunt drop $150 for the chance to rub a stylus on a touch screen!
Give me a few Christmas parties first.
 

Belfast

Member
krypt0nian said:
Who's "shifting attention"? - where do you get this crap?

EDIT: Loading times! See how stupid that is?


Oh, that's right. I forgot the second screen is used for maps, so you pretty much never actually need to look at it.
 
Pedigree Chum said:
I was agreeing with you till your last point. Watching movies on this thing will be great (and easy to do if you were to buy one on a UMD). Music playback might be a bit of a hassle, but that's up to Sony's firmare upgrades.
Most mp3 players will have some sort of movie playback in the future. In a sense I'm happy Sony istrying to go after the iPod market. It may frighten Apple a bit and make a proper revolutionary 5th or 6th gen iPod(with large colour lcd scree, movie playback, improved codec support, better features etc), causing all other mp3 player makers to follow. Well you can always wish :(
 
Belfast said:
Oh, that's right. I forgot the second screen is used for maps, so you pretty much never actually need to look at it.


I forgot - the extra loading time give you a chance to ponder how shiny the PSP screen is.

Again, its easy to bash baselessly huh?


EDIT: Stammering Towards Coherency - at least my posts are honest and not for the "fun factor" AM I RITE?

Feel free to change your tag to the one suggested above. Or just "Jaded Evangelist"
 
lockii said:
Haters and Fans unite! Can we all agree the IGN Editors pic is brilliance?
It was way back when all the E3 Nintendo conference hub-bub was all the rage but has since gotten old for me due to over exposure. Sorry.
 

lexi

Banned
Amir0x said:
*sniff* Did you read my post toward the end of the 4th page? Nobody read it and I need encouragement ;)

Perhaps there could be some sort of IAWTP-ish acronym for when you post those types of posts.

And yes, it's true, in fact, any DS game that does not utilize the 2nd screen in a map-like function is rejected.
 

Jr.

Banned
drohne said:
after the ds's current rash of tamagotchis, graphical chat rooms, and minigame collections, i wonder what sort of preposterous gaming rubbish will be left to dredge up and repackage. love testers? pachislot? hentai dating sims? the mind reels. and after a brief period of reorientation, gets back to lusting after a psp. as the healthy mind must.


This is funny comming from a guy who has obviously NOT played any of the stuff you are bashing. Why not try it before you trash it? Oh, I forgot because you are teh biased. There is a HUGE difference between what the PSOne did to the N64 to what the PSP has to try and do. The PSP has to go on against a $80 toy which plays movies and every kid and parent on the planet knows about. I dont know where you live bu there in the midwest most families consist of two children, and at $200 a pop most parents are gonna pass. On the otherhand at $80 a pop they will give into that. I met a cop today who just bought both of his kids SP's and a bunch of games. Don't think he would have bought them both PSP's at 180 - 200 a pop and games, games that look to fall in around the $50 mark!
 

Jr.

Banned
Drinky Crow said:
MINI-GAMES!!!!11111

It's the new GAF jaded gamer fad! What's next -- virtual puppies? awkwardly scribbling out text messages to folks within earshot?

How long until some of you folks just admit that you've been loathing gaming ever since the Nintendo brand name began its slow, steady slide into cultural irrelevance?

"come on, nintendo, we need something new that we can really call our own! we've been deprived of our sense of subculture superiority for far too long! go ds!"


Dude this thing wasn't made for adults and complaining Gen-xers, its for kids. kids who want to get in trouble in school and goof around. A kid may be wowed by the graphics of the PSP at first but they are gonna go back to the quirky, gimicky, stuff the DS has in the end....more than likely.
 

Amir0x

Banned
lockii said:
Perhaps there could be some sort of IAWTP-ish acronym for when you post those types of posts.

And yes, it's true, in fact, any DS game that does not utilize the 2nd screen in a map-like function is rejected.

*blush*

I agree, btw.
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
If anyone sounds like a super-jaded gamer, it's Drinkles and the DS Hate Machine (sounds like a band! Hmm... there's potential here!!)

I think ANYONE who is a regular poster on this forum is by default, a hardcore gamer (which isn't always a good thing!) and also by default of being that, to some degree out of touch with what the actual reality of the teeming casuall masses is currently like. Those cackling at Nintendo's "gimmicks" like a touch-screen and mini-games, has no real clue about how cool "gimmick" can seem to the uninitiated, kids, and mainstream public. DS has been getting attention due to those "pathetic gimmicks".

As for the touch screen and game design - one thing overlooked is not to knock that there thumbpad pseudo-analog control. It's a clever workaround to get analog control on a handheld without protruding sticks or the limited sensitivity of a pressure sensitive flat button/crosskey. There's potential there for game design on a portable.

However, I should join in and troll the thread, you know, to be cool!

<troll>Haha, PSP is teh suck and loads longer than it takes my grandma to change her dentures! DS cards pwn EVERYTHING! HAHA!</troll>
 

Amir0x

Banned
Kaijima said:
I think ANYONE who is a regular poster on this forum is by default, a hardcore gamer (which isn't always a good thing!) and also by default of being that, to some degree out of touch with what the actual reality of the teeming casuall masses is currently like.

Speak for yourself! I like to think I have a pretty clear grasp on what the casual masses like.
 
Amir0x said:
Everybody loves you. I just love Shuma Gorath. I don't even know what the hell he is except "the character I rock at Marvel Super Heroes vs. Street Fighter with, with ridiculously cheap ass shit that makes people hit me with the pointy end of Saturn controllers." Makes me feel all squishy just thinking about it. Could that be it?
 

Belfast

Member
Jr. said:
Dude this thing wasn't made for adults and complaining Gen-xers, its for kids. kids who want to get in trouble in school and goof around. A kid may be wowed by the graphics of the PSP at first but they are gonna go back to the quirky, gimicky, stuff the DS has in the end....more than likely.

I thought all these kids were busy playing/watching spongebob on the $80 SPs their mommies bought them. The only ones really taking Nintendo's philosophy with the DS to heart are late teen/early 20s proto-children looking for a MINI-GAMES!!!111 fix.
 

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
you might accurately call smooth jazz music for people who don't like music. certainly alice sebold is literature for people who hate literature. and reality television is television for people who don't like reality, television, or much of anything else. none of these are useful analogies to the ds. but no one would mistake the above statements for praise. only with the ds could "but non-gamers like it!" be intended as advocacy. games for people who don't like games. lovely.

but no, keep on with the anecdotes about people who don't like games but do like your ds. and fastidiously repress more typical anecdotes about people who don't like games and look on with a mixture of pity and hilarity as you, a grown and rather fleshy man, poke away at your gameboy. after all, as a ds advocate, you probably like reality as little as does the average viewer of fear factor.
 

HyperionX

Member
I see a lot of people complaining that the touch screen is just useless and will not be used in any meaninful way. That is to be seen. However, compared to the PSP, it is without a doubt superior. I'll explain: first, look at this picture:

psp-release55.jpg


This is the underlining hardware behind the analog "nub" of the PSP. As you can see, there's only 4 communication ports to it. That means 2^4 = 16 possible outputs it can produce, or 16 different directions of movement (and apparently the degree of movement isn't measured from the reports I've read). Since a regular touchpad has 8 possible directions, that makes the analog nub just a touchpad with twice the number of buttons. The Xbox touchpad has 16 possible directions I believe, so it's just an touch-"nub" equivalent to an Xbox controller but harder to control. For all intent and purposes the PSP has no analog control method either, so you can complain all you want about the touchscreen, but in the end it's still something versus nothing.

My opinion is that the touchscreen will allow for the playing of FPS's far, far superior on a DS than on a PSP, making it a lot more popular in western markets than the PSP. The use of RTS games could hypothetically open up totally new sectors of the market (e.g. S. Korea). A port of Starcraft and a bunch of other RTSs gives the DS a much wider selection of potential killer apps than the PSP could hope to obtain. Plus it has every game the GBA has. On the other hand, I'm of the opinion that the PSP will get little other than ports since it has nothing worthwhile to offer over the PS2 except being portable, and in some cases less since it has no real analog control method.

Sony is out of it's league here IMO. Unlike Microsoft, who's Xbox offered Internet gaming and a HD alongside better graphics relative to the PS2 (and of course Halo as well :D), the PSP only offers better graphics over the DS, and less control and battery life to boot, and apparently no killer apps. While graphics certain will draw its converts, it alone, as Xbox has demostrated, means nothing in the big picture.

Yes, of course the PSP also offers movies and mp3 playback. But you'll have to buy those movies (brand new media means buying a PSP copy of everything you may already have), and with a highly limited potential market I see virtually no movies at all unless the PSP takes off, which I don't see either. Audio playback is a joke: memory cards are expensive as hell with a 1GB memory card costing hundreds, versus a Ipod or even one of those cheap Ipod clones it's much too expensive. Only games matter in the end, and PSP isn't delievering there, and has less capability to do so over the DS. In short isn't appealing other than being good to look at despite what all you PSP supporters say. People, at least me, won't buy a gaming device merely because it looks good, instead they buy what they feel will entertain them, and that appears to be the DS.
 

Amir0x

Banned
Kobun Heat said:
Everybody loves you.

I like to think I have a wide range of enemies! It's more fun that way! :lol But seriously, heh, thanks... I think :D

Kobun Heat said:
I just love Shuma Gorath. I don't even know what the hell he is except "the character I rock at Marvel Super Heroes vs. Street Fighter with, with ridiculously cheap ass shit that makes people hit me with the pointy end of Saturn controllers." Makes me feel all squishy just thinking about it. Could that be it?

I love Shuma Gorath. I mostly got the avatar because it's so damned mesmerizing though.
 
drohne said:
games for people who don't like games. lovely.

Frankly, the DS fandoods are welcome to that little demographic. If Puppy Times, Pictochat, <insert collection of goofy mini-games here>, and Animal Crossing are how they get their gaming rocks off these days, let 'em shoot for the fuckin' moon.
 

Belfast

Member
My opinion is that the touchscreen will allow for the playing of FPS's far, far superior on a DS than on a PSP, making it a lot more popular in western markets than the PSP.

Seriously, who buys a handheld with "Gee golly! I can't wait to play FPS games on this thing!"

Well, unless it has a shooting gallery mini-ga... Wait a tic, it comes with one!
 

Amir0x

Banned
HyperionX said:
Sony is out of it's league here IMO. Unlike Microsoft, who's Xbox offered Internet gaming and a HD alongside better graphics relative to the PS2 (and of course Halo as well :D), the PSP only offers better graphics over the DS, and less control and battery life to boot, and apparently no killer apps. While graphics certain will draw its converts, it alone, as Xbox has demostrated, means nothing in the big picture.

The PSP can go online (and already does, to be precise). And as for killer apps, that's so subjective that it's not even worth discussing. For all intents and purposes, Ridge Racers is as much a killer app for PSP as Mario 64 DS is for Nintendo DS. The PSP also offers screen quality that is grand canyon leaps ahead of the competition; visual technology near-PS2 levels... and sound capabilities that once again blow the competition out of the water. That's not even considering the various multimedia capabilities, which you are quick to dismiss. So to be fair you must consider all these things.
 

HyperionX

Member
Amir0x said:
The PSP can go online (and already does, to be precise). And as for killer apps, that's so subjective that it's not even worth discussing. For all intents and purposes, Ridge Racers is as much a killer app for PSP as Mario 64 DS is for Nintendo DS. The PSP also offers screen quality that is grand canyon leaps ahead of the competition; visual technology near-PS2 levels... and sound capabilities that once again blow the competition out of the water. That's not even considering the various multimedia capabilities, which you are quick to dismiss. So to be fair you must consider all these things.

Selective reading = BAD

I considered more than you thought.
 
Drinky Crow said:
Frankly, the DS fandoods are welcome to that little demographic. If Puppy Times, Pictochat, <insert collection of goofy mini-games here>, and Animal Crossing are how they get their gaming rocks off these days, let 'em shoot for the fuckin' moon.


joetheking4.jpg

recordtitle.jpg
 
Belfast said:
Seriously, who buys a handheld with "Gee golly! I can't wait to play FPS games on this thing!"

Well, unless it has a shooting gallery mini-ga... Wait a tic, it comes with one!


Crossing off an entire genre because you have no counter arguement = priceless

Maybe becuase for the first time FPS' are worth playing on a handheld? Perhaps because the controls blow away anything done on a console joypad? Could be because they suggest mouse/keyboard control?

well unless you like an analog nub plus face buttons to mouselook.....Wait a tic, the PSP.
 

Amir0x

Banned
HyperionX said:
Selective read = BAD

I considered more than you thought.

I read the entire thing and responded based on what I thought was important. I ignored the whole analog nub part because I have not played the PSP and thus cannot compare how that controls to the stylus.
 
HyperionX said:
I see a lot of people complaining that the touch screen is just useless and will not be used in any meaninful way. That is to be seen, however, compared to the PSP, it without a doubt superior. I'll explain: first, look at this picture:

psp-release55.jpg


This is the underlining hardware behind the analog "nub" of the PSP. As you can see, there's only 4 communication ports to it. That means 2^4 = 16 possible outputs it can produce, or 16 different directions of movement (and apparently the degree of movement isn't measured from the reports I've read). Since a regular touchpad has 8 possible directions, that makes the analog nub just a touchpad with twice the number of buttons. The Xbox touchpad has 16 possible directions I believe, so it's just an touch-"nub" equivalent to an Xbox controller but harder to control. For all intent and purposes the PSP has no analog control method either, so you can complain all you want about the touchscreen, but in the end it's still something versus nothing.

My opinion is that the touchscreen will allow for the playing of FPS's far, far superior on a DS than on a PSP, making it a lot more popular in western markets than the PSP. The use of RTS games could hypothetically open up totally new sectors of the market (e.g. S. Korea). A port of Starcraft and a bunch of other RTSs gives the DS a much wider selection of potential killer apps than the PSP could hope to obtain. Plus it has every game the GBA has. On the other hand, I'm of the opinion that the PSP will get little other than ports since it has nothing worthwhile to offer over the PS2 except being portable, and in some cases less since it has no real analog control method.

Sony is out of it's league here IMO. Unlike Microsoft, who's Xbox offered Internet gaming and a HD alongside better graphics relative to the PS2 (and of course Halo as well :D), the PSP only offers better graphics over the DS, and less control and battery life to boot, and apparently no killer apps. While graphics certain will draw its converts, it alone, as Xbox has demostrated, means nothing in the big picture.

Yes, of course the PSP also offers movies and mp3 playback. But you'll have to buy those movies (brand new media means buying a PSP copy of everything you may already have), and with a highly limited potential market I see virtually no movies at all unless the PSP takes off, which I don't see either. Audio playback is a joke: memory cards are expensive as hell with a 1GB memory card costing hundreds, versus a Ipod or even one of those cheap Ipod clones it's much too expensive. Only games matter in the end, and PSP isn't delievering there, and has less capability to do so over the DS. In short isn't appealing other than being good to look at despite what all you PSP supporters say. People, at least me, won't buy a gaming device merely because it looks good, instead they buy what they feel will entertain them, and that appears to be the DS.

actually, having 4 pinouts there doesn't mean there are only 16 levels of sensitivity...

oh, and the xbox doesn't have 16 levels either...

the conclusions you draw from the pic are wild and speculative...
 

AstroLad

Hail to the KING baby
Ah, these DS discussions remind me (almost frighteningly so) of the last year of the Dreamcast (and yes I know Nintendo=TEH HANDHELD DOMINATORE, but I'm referring to the nature of the discussions and the arguments summoned). Fun to be had by all.
 

Belfast

Member
krypt0nian said:
Crossing off an entire genre because you have no counter arguement = priceless

Maybe becuase for the first time FPS' are worth playing on a handheld? Perhaps because the controls blow away anything done on a console joypad? Could be because they suggest mouse/keyboard control?

well unless you like an analog nub plus face buttons to mouselook.....Wait a tic, the PSP.

I lived with an analogue stick and face buttons to control Goldeneye and Perfect Dark.

But anyone who's serious about an FPS in the first place already has a PC. FPS games are about immersion and I can't imagine anyone salivating to play them on a liliputian screen with odd lighting and a bastardized sound system. How do you fathom that the promise of an FPS would necessarily be a selling point for a handheld system?
 
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